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How do!

Kind of trying different research avenues, to see if I can diagnose a problem with my car.

Few weeks back I had to buy a new battery. Whilst I’ve not exactly driven it that often, said battery managed a 150 mile round trip just fine, plus a couple of much shorter sorties.

Today however, I got about 30 miles from home when the battery died. Started with the Battery Warning Light coming on, then the stereo cut out. Managed to pull over safe. Shut off engine, put hazards on. Then it wouldn’t restart.

Been recovered to home now, so nothing urgent urgent. Tow Company used a jump pack, and she turned over and started just fine. So whilst I don’t know a whole bunch about cars, I feel I can rule out the Starter Motor being the problem.

But…I am wondering if it’s perhaps the Alternator? Again going off super ropey knowledge, but that’s the bit that maintains the charge. I say wondering, as unless it died during the journey, I don’t think my car would do 30 miles without the battery being recharged.

Any thoughts? Yes, sod off and ask a garage is a completely valid answer, so I won’t take offence.

It’s an 08 Plate Ford Fiesta, if that helps. Already found a video on how to swap out an Alternator and it doesn’t look too tricky, but looking for other input before I take that step.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
How do!

Kind of trying different research avenues, to see if I can diagnose a problem with my car.

Few weeks back I had to buy a new battery. Whilst I’ve not exactly driven it that often, said battery managed a 150 mile round trip just fine, plus a couple of much shorter sorties.

Today however, I got about 30 miles from home when the battery died. Started with the Battery Warning Light coming on, then the stereo cut out. Managed to pull over safe. Shut off engine, put hazards on. Then it wouldn’t restart.

Been recovered to home now, so nothing urgent urgent. Tow Company used a jump pack, and she turned over and started just fine. So whilst I don’t know a whole bunch about cars, I feel I can rule out the Starter Motor being the problem.

But…I am wondering if it’s perhaps the Alternator? Again going off super ropey knowledge, but that’s the bit that maintains the charge. I say wondering, as unless it died during the journey, I don’t think my car would do 30 miles without the battery being recharged.

Any thoughts? Yes, sod off and ask a garage is a completely valid answer, so I won’t take offence.

It’s an 08 Plate Ford Fiesta, if that helps. Already found a video on how to swap out an Alternator and it doesn’t look too tricky, but looking for other input before I take that step.

Have you checked the cables and contacts? It's not too unreasonable that they failed to connect them properly when exchanging your old battery, and thus your new one wasn't charged at all, and you basically drove around on the factory charge. Or you may have a frayed or otherwise broken cable somewhere in there, that got shaken loose while you drove around. Would be my first thing to check long before thinking of the more complicated stuff.

Edit: can you get a readout of your DTC codes somehow? Usually these are a bit more detailled than the dashboard lights and may actually tell you the specific problem.

DTC codes is a good place to start! Will look up how to do that. I know I did it on my previous car.

It could be the alternator, but it could also be the cabling from the alternator to the battery. Make sure to mention that to the garage when getting it checked out. It's not just incorrect fitting, but also could be damage to the cable.

We had that and it took an AA guy pointing it out whilst the garage had been happy to fit a 3rd alternator after the original and a second had both "died" on us and not kept up the charge.

So do get the cabling checked as well as the alternator itself.

Ta both. Definitely makes sense to check the easiest fixes first - once you know what the easiest fixes might be!

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Ta both. Definitely makes sense to check the easiest fixes first - once you know what the easiest fixes might be!

If you have a multimeter you can basically work back from the battery towards the alternator, that's usually the easiest way to spot the problem. If you have a powerbank that doubles as a battery starter and diagnostic tool that could come in helpful too - don't discount the possibility that you got sold a bum battery, it happens even at honest shops.

Yeah I don’t have any of those!

Battery does have a guarantee though, so that’s nice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I’m mostly confused that the new battery did my commute first time with no problems, then decided not to charge.

Again far from an expert, but I’d expect it to be an arse from the get go?

Well the battery has a charge within itself when you get it so it can run on that; plus it might be getting some power from the alternator assembly (alternator and cabling).

What it might not be getting is a full charge. So the more its used the more its drained and it hits a limit point and gives out on you. Charge it up again and it will go for a while and then likely give out again.

Temperature can also mess with batteries a lot as well, so might be the first trip things were warmer from the start and the second things were colder, so an already reduced charge got knocked down even more.





Best thing is a garage for a repair and just be sure they check everything - battery, alternator and cables. Heck as noted above a cable check is a few minutes

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Yeah I don’t have any of those!

Battery does have a guarantee though, so that’s nice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I’m mostly confused that the new battery did my commute first time with no problems, then decided not to charge.

Again far from an expert, but I’d expect it to be an arse from the get go?

There are some failure modes in some types of batteries that basically lead to them not recharging well, mostly due to being stored for too long, or at very cold or hot temperatures. It's not something that is usually visible from the outside, sometimes it just happens more or less without prior warning - they give you maybe a couple dozen good starts and then they'll just give up. Cold weather makes it worse, often these duds are barely making it in normal conditions and then drop dead after a coldsnap.

Looking at it from a logical POV, it seems unlikely it's the battery itself. You've had the same problem with the new one as the old, so the advice here seems like the place to start.

Alternator or cables would be my first guess.

Sounds like I can’t dodge taking her to the garage.

Ah well! Luckily there’s a really good local one just at the end of my road. And you know a garage can be trusted when it’s two older gents who’ve clearly been in that game for decades.

Slipspace wrote:
Looking at it from a logical POV, it seems unlikely it's the battery itself. You've had the same problem with the new one as the old, so the advice here seems like the place to start.

Alternator or cables would be my first guess.

Battery is by far the easiest thing to check though and should be gotten out of the way purely on principle, to avoid doing relatively expensive checks first only to find out it was the battery after all much later ... ask me how i know... grumble

The battery is still under guarantee, so a quick checkup should be free anyway.

Getting the same info from my friendly Enginseer.]

Cheers all. Will wander down the garage and find out how much for a diagnostic.

If your vehicle starting doesn't sound like metal on metal screeching electrical sounding orgy of noise..(see what I did there) ..then you more likely need to
Tightening your alternator down.

Being the Alternator is set against the engine body. Vehicle/engine vibration may cause a disconnect in recharging the battery while running.

Just throwing that out there.

Being in a proper grump. Arse in hands type proper grump? I nicked off to the pub - but stopped in at aforementioned local garage.

Car is having a diagnostic on Monday. As I work from home Mon-Thurs, that’s super convenient.

Hopefully it is just some low level maintenance, or a duff battery. Whatever it is I’ll know some point on Monday.

The battery's job is to hold enough charge to start the engine. That's about it.

When the car is running the electrical systems are powered by the engine via the alternator.

I'm assuming you think your battery failed because the battery light came on, but that light in fact indicates a fault anywhere in the charging system on most cars.

It's unusual for an alternator to fail spontaneously, but if you decided you needed a new battery, rather than somebody checking the voltage from the alt was enough to be recharging your last one and just went out and bought one (when in reality the battery was fine and just not getting charged properly) then it's possible the warning signs were missed.

Given the recent battery swap, I'd check for something as simple as the terminal popping off, although one would hope the breakdown driver would catch that, if he was just focused on recovering rather than fixing the car, he might have missed it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, and if you've got to learn how to change an alternator from YouTube, don't try and change an alternator, they're too important and too expensive to feth up. Plus remember the mantra that every 20 minute job is one sheared bolt from a 3 day nightmare.

Tow Driver was just towing. Turns out my tax ran out Feb 1st, so strictly speaking my vehicle wasn’t roadworthy so The AA couldn’t simply send me on my way.

I should probably add the previous battery appeared to have leaked, as there was greenish discharged from one of the terminals.

Shall find out on Monday, I guess!

You were lucky, I had a breakdown the day I bought a car once, before the era of online registration when it could take a few weeks to sort all the documents, so consequently wasn't taxed.

Breakdown driver told me that because I wasn't taxed it shouldn't be on the road, fethed off without touching it and left me to get it recovered well over a hundred miles at my own expense. His one concession was to give my passenger a lift to the train station as she had a plane to catch (which she didn't.)

Still, in the era of monthly rolling direct debits...

Some residual corrosion around the terminals is perfectly normal if the battery's been installed for a few years, but if you're right and it has leaked (and likely been doing so for a while, this things are generally progressive not spontaneous) then I suspect that'll be the cause of the problems, precisely what damage that's done will need hands on examination.

 Azreal13 wrote:
You were lucky, I had a breakdown the day I bought a car once, before the era of online registration when it could take a few weeks to sort all the documents, so consequently wasn't taxed.

Breakdown driver told me that because I wasn't taxed it shouldn't be on the road, fethed off without touching it and left me to get it recovered well over a hundred miles at my own expense. His one concession was to give my passenger a lift to the train station as she had a plane to catch (which she didn't.)

Still, in the era of monthly rolling direct debits...

Some residual corrosion around the terminals is perfectly normal if the battery's been installed for a few years, but if you're right and it has leaked (and likely been doing so for a while, this things are generally progressive not spontaneous) then I suspect that'll be the cause of the problems, precisely what damage that's done will need hands on examination.

'Greenish discharge' may not need to be a battery leak, it could also be some sort of anticorrosive spray or paste to ensure contact and prevent corrosion, a lot of shops spray or slop it on as a matter of course whenever they do any work on the battery. Some of these products are bright blue or bright green.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
How do!

Kind of trying different research avenues, to see if I can diagnose a problem with my car.

Few weeks back I had to buy a new battery. Whilst I’ve not exactly driven it that often, said battery managed a 150 mile round trip just fine, plus a couple of much shorter sorties.

Today however, I got about 30 miles from home when the battery died. Started with the Battery Warning Light coming on, then the stereo cut out. Managed to pull over safe. Shut off engine, put hazards on. Then it wouldn’t restart.

Been recovered to home now, so nothing urgent urgent. Tow Company used a jump pack, and she turned over and started just fine. So whilst I don’t know a whole bunch about cars, I feel I can rule out the Starter Motor being the problem.

But…I am wondering if it’s perhaps the Alternator? Again going off super ropey knowledge, but that’s the bit that maintains the charge. I say wondering, as unless it died during the journey, I don’t think my car would do 30 miles without the battery being recharged.

Any thoughts? Yes, sod off and ask a garage is a completely valid answer, so I won’t take offence.

It’s an 08 Plate Ford Fiesta, if that helps. Already found a video on how to swap out an Alternator and it doesn’t look too tricky, but looking for other input before I take that step.

You said it "turned over and started just fine" with the use of a jump pack. Did it keep running afterwards? This is important for determining if it's your alternator or a wiring problem (probably in the ground wires, if so).

Tsagualsa wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
You were lucky, I had a breakdown the day I bought a car once, before the era of online registration when it could take a few weeks to sort all the documents, so consequently wasn't taxed.

Breakdown driver told me that because I wasn't taxed it shouldn't be on the road, fethed off without touching it and left me to get it recovered well over a hundred miles at my own expense. His one concession was to give my passenger a lift to the train station as she had a plane to catch (which she didn't.)

Still, in the era of monthly rolling direct debits...

Some residual corrosion around the terminals is perfectly normal if the battery's been installed for a few years, but if you're right and it has leaked (and likely been doing so for a while, this things are generally progressive not spontaneous) then I suspect that'll be the cause of the problems, precisely what damage that's done will need hands on examination.

'Greenish discharge' may not need to be a battery leak, it could also be some sort of anticorrosive spray or paste to ensure contact and prevent corrosion, a lot of shops spray or slop it on as a matter of course whenever they do any work on the battery. Some of these products are bright blue or bright green.

The stuff on my terminals is more of a beige yellowy colour, I'm assuming, in the absence of much else detail, that the green was just a bit of oxidised copper, given it was an old battery, but yeah, some sort of contact paste certainly isn't impossible.

A bit late to the discussion but there is a thing called a "battery keeper" which I have used with great success over the years.

It's basically a long extension cord with a lighted box in the middle and clamps that fit on the battery (or designated terminals).

All you do is plug it in and hook it onto the terminals and leave it overnight. It will recharge a drained battery or keep a battery up to strength against the perils of temperature fluctuation. Also useful if a vehicle has been idle for a while, like a riding mower sitting in a garage through the winter.

I got it when I had starting issues with one of my cars and it was SOP to pull in and hook it up over the winter. Got me through spring when more comprehensive solutions became feasible.

 Azreal13 wrote:
You were lucky, I had a breakdown the day I bought a car once, before the era of online registration when it could take a few weeks to sort all the documents, so consequently wasn't taxed.

Breakdown driver told me that because I wasn't taxed it shouldn't be on the road, fethed off without touching it and left me to get it recovered well over a hundred miles at my own expense. His one concession was to give my passenger a lift to the train station as she had a plane to catch (which she didn't.)

Still, in the era of monthly rolling direct debits...

Some residual corrosion around the terminals is perfectly normal if the battery's been installed for a few years, but if you're right and it has leaked (and likely been doing so for a while, this things are generally progressive not spontaneous) then I suspect that'll be the cause of the problems, precisely what damage that's done will need hands on examination.

Most frustrating regarding the tax is the DVLA need the code from your V5C (pink slip equivalent), which being sensible I keep at home - not in the car.

Reckon I’ll make a note of that code and stash it somewhere in the car, just in case. Will hopefully never need it, but have and not need is of course preferable.

As for the goo on the old battery, it was only evident on one of the terminals, hence I’m thinking it’s leakage.

After 6pm I’ll go move the car to outside my house. That way I’ll know if it still starts. Can also bring the battery in for charging if needs must. Even if all of that fails, getting it outside means I only need push it down the road to the garage tomorrow. Nice and flat, straight run. Will be a pain but not too awful in the circumstances.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
How do!

Kind of trying different research avenues, to see if I can diagnose a problem with my car.

Few weeks back I had to buy a new battery. Whilst I’ve not exactly driven it that often, said battery managed a 150 mile round trip just fine, plus a couple of much shorter sorties.

Today however, I got about 30 miles from home when the battery died. Started with the Battery Warning Light coming on, then the stereo cut out. Managed to pull over safe. Shut off engine, put hazards on. Then it wouldn’t restart.

Been recovered to home now, so nothing urgent urgent. Tow Company used a jump pack, and she turned over and started just fine. So whilst I don’t know a whole bunch about cars, I feel I can rule out the Starter Motor being the problem.

But…I am wondering if it’s perhaps the Alternator? Again going off super ropey knowledge, but that’s the bit that maintains the charge. I say wondering, as unless it died during the journey, I don’t think my car would do 30 miles without the battery being recharged.

Any thoughts? Yes, sod off and ask a garage is a completely valid answer, so I won’t take offence.

It’s an 08 Plate Ford Fiesta, if that helps. Already found a video on how to swap out an Alternator and it doesn’t look too tricky, but looking for other input before I take that step.

You said it "turned over and started just fine" with the use of a jump pack. Did it keep running afterwards? This is important for determining if it's your alternator or a wiring problem (probably in the ground wires, if so).

Yeah it kept running, thankfully.

Ok, so your alternator is working at least some of the time. In my experience, an alternator that is starting to go bad will either only work at certain RPMs, or you need to "play with it" a bit to get it to "catch", and start charging, usually by revving the engine. It would help if your car had a guage that would tell you when you were and were not getting a charge, but I'm guessing that it only has a warning light? I'd start by checking the wiring. If all that checks out, probably the alternator.

Just the warning light unfortunately. Never gone in for particularly fancy cars.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Car moved. Died just round the corner from home.

Still. Once I’ve caught me breath, out with the tool kit, get the battery charged. Just needs to make it maybe 200 metres in the morning.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Just the warning light unfortunately. Never gone in for particularly fancy cars.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Car moved. Died just round the corner from home.

Still. Once I’ve caught me breath, out with the tool kit, get the battery charged. Just needs to make it maybe 200 metres in the morning.

Ergh. That tells me you're not charging. It's definitely an Alternator/wiring problem. Probably the Alternator. Please, MDG, don't try any long distance travel before you get it figured out. I don't want you getting stuck.

Booked in for the garage tomorrow. Thankfully it’s literally at the end of my street.

Battery does seem to be charging from the charging kit thing I’ve got, so yeah, definitely probably the Alternator.

Am also signed up to the AA now, so got solid breakdown cover for the future.

In terms of the repair, it is what it is. I can’t do without my car, and thankfully whilst I am leaving it to the professionals, it doesn’t look too complex a job. And being a Ford, I can’t imagine parts will be hard to come by. Next expected Office day is Friday, so plenty of time to get it fixed between now and then. And if it’s not, I’ll just do two days in the following week.

Seriously folks, do consider getting your own Breakdown Cover. Don’t do a me! That gets expensive.

My big reservation is that most of the things being discussed would stop the car starting but they wouldn't stop the car running.

Unless they were utterly fethed, but if they're utterly fethed then I'm a little surprised that the car starts at all.

Haven't driven a Ford in 25 years though, so who knows how the ECU is programmed to manage certain faults.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Just the warning light unfortunately. Never gone in for particularly fancy cars.

Your car was built in the 21st century, I'm afraid to say from a mechanical standpoint it's very fancy, the engine bay will be plastered in sensors, potentially everything from airflow in to exhaust temperature, voltage sensors, temperature sensors, position sensors. Sure, if it's a 3 cylinder petrol it'll be less sophisticated than a bigger diesel unit or whatever, but while it could be something simple, it's probably best you brace yourself, just in case it's some randomly specific bit that only Ford supply.

Such as the time Nissan, with a straight face, quoted me £120 and a 3 month wait for an in dash clock.

Don’t say those sorts of things 😂😂

Gonna burn some incense, see if I can’t attract the Omnissiah’s favour.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Bit of nosing around online suggests I’m looking at around £400 or so to replace the alternator. So I’m guessing that’s probably my worst case scenario.

Far from ideal, but what the hell else am I gonna do 😂😂

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Don’t say those sorts of things 😂😂

Gonna burn some incense, see if I can’t attract the Omnissiah’s favour.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Bit of nosing around online suggests I’m looking at around £400 or so to replace the alternator. So I’m guessing that’s probably my worst case scenario.

Far from ideal, but what the hell else am I gonna do 😂😂

Don't fret too much yet, it might still be a 4£ cable