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 Dysartes wrote:

It isn't that much fun trying to play a combat team (like Dwarfs or Chaos) against the much-hated high Agility, dodging, passing, leaping Elves or Skaven.

You get your fun when you have the ball, the hitters get theirs when they have control.

And stalling a score can backfire - I've drawn games I should've won when I went for one last block instead of getting the Runner with the ball into the end zone.

It's just so damn difficult to escape the 2-1 grind. Leap is risky unless you got very lucky and have AG 5. For dodge, that is easily countered with Tackle and Diving Tackle.

How the new rules compare to the classic Blood Bowl?

(I asked that as someone who never played the original, just interested in the reception among veterans of this new version).

Very similar. So far there is one new skill for Skaven Gutter Runners. Some slight variation to league play and money. Some minor price change for Human Catcher? There was a list somewhere on the previous pages.

The existing rules are so fine tuned, I don't see room for big changes, unless the entire game is redesigned from scratch.

By the way, anyone noticed Morg'n Thorg is only available to Orcs and Humans? He used to be available for quite a lot of teams before.

Yeah, the core rules don't seem to have changed much, or at all; seems like the biggest differences will be in the details of league play and probably some rebalancing of the teams which, to be honest, is where the refinement has been needed for the longest time so…

Baxx wrote:
By the way, anyone noticed Morg'n Thorg is only available to Orcs and Humans? He used to be available for quite a lot of teams before.

Unless we've seen a listing from Death Zone for him, I'm wondering if the entry in the core book only lists those two to try to minimise confusion.

It would seem a little odd if his DZ entry only has him working for Humans and Orcs, though.

Has anything been said yet about how Star Players will be being released? Metal reissues of old figures, or new resin sculpts? Which reminds me, I need to find where I left my metal original Mighty Zug, so I can get him painted up...

I has to be new sculpts , the old is incompatible with the new level of design.

If the cards in the starter box is that simplified, then that info is also quite useless for anyone taking one step further. Will Star Players have multiple versions of cards? One noob friendly for starter box, one for Season 1 listing the teams released then, and further cards for teams released later?

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

 Anpu-adom wrote:
Yeah, I expect at least three season books. We still need stuntie and big guy teams, dungeon ball, undead teams, and chaos teams. Only 2 of those 4 will really fit into a single book.
That being said, GW developers promised a PDF for other current teams.

Doesn't the Season 1 Death Zone book have 7 teams? Why do you think the next book will only have 2 teams?

Stunty and "Big Guy" aren't referring to teams, but themes of teams... Stunty refers to little guys, like Halflings, Goblins, and possibly Lizardmen who can't score without the Skinks.

Baxx wrote:
If the cards in the starter box is that simplified, then that info is also quite useless for anyone taking one step further. Will Star Players have multiple versions of cards? One noob friendly for starter box, one for Season 1 listing the teams released then, and further cards for teams released later?

Merely posing it as an option for now - until DZ is in people's hands, we won't know. It would seem odd to cut a bunch of the teams such an iconic Player can play for.

It would be a nice touch if the Star Players came with their Star Player card, especially any that don't get cards in the core game.

 Dysartes wrote:

Baxx wrote:
By the way, anyone noticed Morg'n Thorg is only available to Orcs and Humans? He used to be available for quite a lot of teams before.

Unless we've seen a listing from Death Zone for him, I'm wondering if the entry in the core book only lists those two to try to minimise confusion.

It would seem a little odd if his DZ entry only has him working for Humans and Orcs, though.

Has anything been said yet about how Star Players will be being released? Metal reissues of old figures, or new resin sculpts? Which reminds me, I need to find where I left my metal original Mighty Zug, so I can get him painted up...

The first four star player sculpts (Morg, Varag, Zug and Griff) were done by theForgeworld open this summer.

They will be Forgeworld resin releases. The plan this summer was to release them on the Forgeworld webstore.

It would be a fairly clever move if they went up for preorder next weekend (So they´ll ship on the same day a people can buy the main box) or on black friday (coinciding with the release.)

 Dysartes wrote:

Baxx wrote:
By the way, anyone noticed Morg'n Thorg is only available to Orcs and Humans? He used to be available for quite a lot of teams before.

Unless we've seen a listing from Death Zone for him, I'm wondering if the entry in the core book only lists those two to try to minimise confusion.

It would seem a little odd if his DZ entry only has him working for Humans and Orcs, though.

Has anything been said yet about how Star Players will be being released? Metal reissues of old figures, or new resin sculpts? Which reminds me, I need to find where I left my metal original Mighty Zug, so I can get him painted up...

By fine tuned I assume you mean AGI 2 teams losing virtually every time to AGI 4 teams because the entire game is built on agility. Being a "hitter" doesn't mean much when you only get experience for injuring which is a 10 on 2d6 for 2 exp vs 4 EXP (1 catch, 3 touchdown) for the elves that score. BB is anything but balanced.

 Kirasu wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

Baxx wrote:
By the way, anyone noticed Morg'n Thorg is only available to Orcs and Humans? He used to be available for quite a lot of teams before.

Unless we've seen a listing from Death Zone for him, I'm wondering if the entry in the core book only lists those two to try to minimise confusion.

It would seem a little odd if his DZ entry only has him working for Humans and Orcs, though.

Has anything been said yet about how Star Players will be being released? Metal reissues of old figures, or new resin sculpts? Which reminds me, I need to find where I left my metal original Mighty Zug, so I can get him painted up...

By fine tuned I assume you mean AGI 2 teams losing virtually every time to AGI 4 teams because the entire game is built on agility. Being a "hitter" doesn't mean much when you only get experience for injuring which is a 10 on 2d6 for 2 exp vs 4 EXP (1 catch, 3 touchdown) for the elves that score. BB is anything but balanced.

That's the thing... you're not wrong, per se.... but, in theory, those AG4 teams are loaded up with Armor 7 guys, and by the 2nd half, your numbers advantage can be so incredibly lopsided that you get your punching, and score as well.

People sure AG4 is too powerful are the same people who insist on receiving at the start of the game when it would be far better for them to do so 2nd half against a depleted opponent. Some teams win by playing the whole game, some win in the back end.

Being depleted doesn't matter when you win all your games and get the win bonus. My wood elves could easily beat an entire Chaos army with only 3 models on the field at the end of a turn.

The thing is, it's very unlikely your guys will get seriously hurt because everything is a 2d6 roll that requires high numbers on both the damage AND injury chart where as a high AGI team can score reliably every 2 turns by just not rolling 2 1s

 Kirasu wrote:
Being depleted doesn't matter when you win all your games and get the win bonus. My wood elves could easily beat an entire Chaos army with only 3 models on the field at the end of a turn.

The thing is, it's very unlikely your guys will get seriously hurt because everything is a 2d6 roll that requires high numbers on both the damage AND injury chart where as a high AGI team can score reliably every 2 turns by just not rolling 2 1s

I'm no BB master, but as someone with more than 500 games under his belt I think I can say that things tend to balance out over time. High armor teams have to play the long game - minimize risk, hit with 2 dice every chance you can, cage up, stall, and foul when you can get away with it in early games and eventually you'll start accruing SPPs. When your prancing Elves are 10 or 12 games into a league and play a Chaos, Dwarf, or Orc team with a decent number of guys with Block, Tackle, and Mighty Blow, you're going to hit the deck A LOT... (Not to mention a couple failed GFI's adding armor/injury rolls on top of that). When you're adding +1 from MB to that injury roll you're at 9+, which is a 25% chance of being injured every time you hit the deck. Yeah, in initial games those Elves are great at handling the ball and scoring but eventually those high armor teams build some skills and everything will even out.

Elves don't live to above 1700TV. After that, it's all bash, Necro, Undead, Dwarves and Chaos. Agility only has a chance in lower TV. And Agility teams lose their players so fast.

I held on to my AG 6 wardancer for many games, but he got AV 5 and multiple Niggling Injuries.

 Kirasu wrote:
Being depleted doesn't matter when you win all your games and get the win bonus. My wood elves could easily beat an entire Chaos army with only 3 models on the field at the end of a turn.

The thing is, it's very unlikely your guys will get seriously hurt because everything is a 2d6 roll that requires high numbers on both the damage AND injury chart where as a high AGI team can score reliably every 2 turns by just not rolling 2 1s

Wood elves are a top tier team at any level (largely due to war dancers, but the overall team is a strong mix of stats and skills), but there's a few other comparably strong teams with lower agility (notably, undead).

Saying the game is agility based ignores a lot of nuance in the risk. Elves rely on the dodge, and a dodge never gets more reliable than 1/36. Blocks are much more reliable even without block/wrestle.

After wood elves, I consider the other elves to be more middle of the pack, because they are full of expensive players and either suffer from lack of core skills (pro and high elfs), or generally average statlines (dark elves).

League structure plays into things a lot - a tabletop league is quite different to online play, even though everyone follows the same rules.

Switching topic for a second - has anyone whose LGS (or local GW) has the new board on display been able to get a measurement for the size of the new squares?

Trying to figure out if Mighty Zug on a 40mm lipped base is going to be too big - if so, I'll have to see if I can get him onto a 30mm base.

A 32mm round base fits inside the lines on them, making the whole square about 33-34mm across. A 40mm round base would overlap by a bit but it would still be clear which square they're actually in.

Yep I noticed that as well, they upped the scale of the board, but it still does not look like it is going to fit a big guys base on without overlapping.

Maybe the FW big guys will all be mounted on a 32mm base?
as they fit just right.

I saw the new models today. They look fantastic! Especially the orcs which are smaller than I imagined.

Any news on the Dwarf release date? I am desperate for them.

 Bottle wrote:
I saw the new models today. They look fantastic! Especially the orcs which are smaller than I imagined.

Any news on the Dwarf release date? I am desperate for them.

Last I saw, they were coming out in January.

 Kirasu wrote:
Being depleted doesn't matter when you win all your games and get the win bonus. My wood elves could easily beat an entire Chaos army with only 3 models on the field at the end of a turn.

The thing is, it's very unlikely your guys will get seriously hurt because everything is a 2d6 roll that requires high numbers on both the damage AND injury chart where as a high AGI team can score reliably every 2 turns by just not rolling 2 1s

Yeah. Thid does'nt happen.

Ever.

I had a chaos team benched by injuries

I had woodelves unable to pick up the ball 3 spaces from the end zone with no tackle zones

I watched a gutter runner kill a Minotaur with no assists.

It can happen....it will happen

I won with a passing game… with Orcs… in a Blizzard.

I forced a 0-0 draw against Wood Elves with Goblins, both with TV < 1300.

lol, we should start a whole thread for "IMPOSSIBLE BLOODBOWL STORIES"

I read that future variants of the dugout will be done in some sort of cloth like GW's chaos battle mat. Has anyone heard if they'll be doing variations of the pitch this way as well?

 rayphoton wrote:
lol, we should start a whole thread for "IMPOSSIBLE BLOODBOWL STORIES"

I could fill the thread by myself.

My all-time favorite was my mummy blocking a halfling and rolling triple skulls, then rerolling... triple skulls again. Predictably, the mummy failed his armor roll and died (he did regenerate though).

Again, with Nuffle, if it CAN happen it WILL happen at some point.

 infinite_array wrote:
So, this is annoying.

I'm trying to order Blood Bowwl from my FLGS. I can get the starter set and the book. But the store needs at least 4 boxset preorders for the store to be allowed to order Skaven teams. And they need 15 preorders to be allowed to preorder the Skaven dice.

That sounds weird. The rep here has said they can't put in pre orders for stuff. They just put in regular orders and have to hope there's still product left when they get around to prepping the order. Which they don't do until two days before product goes live because that's how long it takes to ship to the FLGS. If it takes them longer to ship they'll prep the order sooner. Store's punished for having a short ship time.

GW production hasn't caught up with demand... they are putting in ordering caps. For example, one Season One Book for every 2 Games, one skaven box for every 4 Games, and one set of Skaven dice for every 8 Games...
Not sure of the actual numbers, but I know that the limiting is happening. It may even vary from area to area.

GW seems to be trying the Nintendo model. Release knowing that you don't have enough product in the places that you will need them, and quickly ship to where the product needs to go. Generally, it keeps interest high while reducing overhead. People eventually get what they want, and the shelf price doesn't fluctuate with demand.
Also, frustrating as hell for consumers and FLGS.

 Mr_Rose wrote:
I won with a passing game… with Orcs… in a Blizzard.

One turn touchdown.

Against Skaven.

With Dwarves...