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 lord_blackfang wrote:
Sigmarine with Lantern 2.0
Elf dual wielding boat anchors
Nighthaunt with scythe to defy racial stereotypes a little
Free Cities pistol expert
Bigass horse, looks Darkoath?
Overall I'm guessing the "realm shaking things on the way" is a big ol year of "book and 1 hero" releases.

most likely.

But, we are still "owed" Umbraneth or Malerions Aelves or whatever they end up being called, and Chaos Dwarves as things that are being heavily hinted but yet to arrive, and there are rumors of the big-ass Skaven refresh happening with the launch of AoS4 this summer, so we may get a little something more-more.

Well range refreshes aren't really a limited thing anymore. So there could be multiple again next year.

I REALLY hope GW are going to update the Marauders for Slaves to Darkness. It still utterly baffles me that they've given them almost a dozen themed war parties through Warcry - each one of which looks freaking awesome - and yet the basic Maruders are still there looking REALLY rubbishy

I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

Well i think most people assumed the basic marauder was extinct with all the various cultist types around now. But perhaps this is going to be a Darkoath specific version rather than just generic.


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 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

Yes, 4 range refreshes in almost one year certainly feels unsubstatial

 Overread wrote:
I REALLY hope GW are going to update the Marauders for Slaves to Darkness. It still utterly baffles me that they've given them almost a dozen themed war parties through Warcry - each one of which looks freaking awesome - and yet the basic Maruders are still there looking REALLY rubbishy

Frankly I’d bet on them getting punted over to TOW when Chaos Warriors come out like what’s just happened to Cities of Sigmar.

Lord Zarkov wrote:

 Overread wrote:
I REALLY hope GW are going to update the Marauders for Slaves to Darkness. It still utterly baffles me that they've given them almost a dozen themed war parties through Warcry - each one of which looks freaking awesome - and yet the basic Maruders are still there looking REALLY rubbishy

Frankly I’d bet on them getting punted over to TOW when Chaos Warriors come out like what’s just happened to Cities of Sigmar.

Though not fully. We know there's units in both cos and tow. No reason marauders can't be same.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

I know what you mean and I think its simply because the game has a lot of factions that are "half" size or which are still in need of a massive range update.

I think it just shows how massive a hole AoS had in terms of army updates, esp when we honestly don't consider it a 5-7 year old game but a 35-40 year old game (because most of the armies are from Old World). Plus how many armies got broken down into tiny fragments of what they were before.


Take Death - the entire GA of Death is basically 1 single army from Old World broken into 4 parts. What was once one massive army is now fragmented into 4. Which means to bulk those up GW has to do 4X the work to get there. Now they've done really well - Nighthaunt and Soulblight feel very fleshed out; Flesheaters are getting some well needed attention now and Ossiarchs had a strong start, but I'd really love to see them get a nice chunky update. Perhaps a point and stat reduction to allow for a chunky update otherwise they'd run the risk of being an elite army that can't take many of their toys to the table.

I could see new ones being Darkoath specific in style and then the old being kicked over.

My feeling is that Marauders (and Marauder Horsemen) get the Empire treatment ala Cities of Sigmar and get cut from the Slaves to Darkness battletom in AoS4. They will stick with the warcry cults as an alternative to marauders, and let proper marauders become a TOW thing.


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 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

Right? I'm the same way with it lol. I think its in part because theres still a lot of old WHFB models present, but also a lot of the early AoS releases were very WHFB adjacent (and could well have been WHFB sculpts that were released for a different game). Fyreslayers for example might as well be WHFB dwarf slayers, but barring a couple of the sculpts were all released in the AoS era. Many of the new Seraphon sculpts are for thing thats had rules in the WHFB era, likewise like 2/3rds of the Gloomspite gitz units are old WHFB units, half of which have had AoS resculpts, the other half are still old WHFB minis. Flesh Eater Courts are an outlier, as the majority of the minis to date are legacy WHFB sculpts, and the new wave thats coming out are all new units that never existed in WHFB with only one actual resculpt (Varghulf) of an hold WHFB mini.


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 Overread wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

I know what you mean and I think its simply because the game has a lot of factions that are "half" size or which are still in need of a massive range update.

I think it just shows how massive a hole AoS had in terms of army updates, esp when we honestly don't consider it a 5-7 year old game but a 35-40 year old game (because most of the armies are from Old World). Plus how many armies got broken down into tiny fragments of what they were before.


Take Death - the entire GA of Death is basically 1 single army from Old World broken into 4 parts. What was once one massive army is now fragmented into 4. Which means to bulk those up GW has to do 4X the work to get there. Now they've done really well - Nighthaunt and Soulblight feel very fleshed out; Flesheaters are getting some well needed attention now and Ossiarchs had a strong start, but I'd really love to see them get a nice chunky update. Perhaps a point and stat reduction to allow for a chunky update otherwise they'd run the risk of being an elite army that can't take many of their toys to the table.

Thats true of Soulblight Gravelords, Nighthaunt, and Flesh-Eater Courts... but Ossiarch Bonereapers? They are one of a handful of born and bred AoS factions and weren't spun off of VC at all. They are more a replacement for Tomb Kings than anything to do with the old VC army. Yes, they have skeleton warriors, but of a pretty distinct and different flavor from the actual VC skeleton analogue within Soulblight.


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 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
I could see new ones being Darkoath specific in style and then the old being kicked over.

...you mean... Darkoath Savagers? They already exist.

chaos0xomega wrote:

Thats true of Soulblight Gravelords, Nighthaunt, and Flesh-Eater Courts... but Ossiarch Bonereapers? They are one of a handful of born and bred AoS factions and weren't spun off of VC at all. They are more a replacement for Tomb Kings than anything to do with the old VC army. Yes, they have skeleton warriors, but of a pretty distinct and different flavor from the actual VC skeleton analogue within Soulblight.

Yes and no. The concept of them is AoS, but the designs for them are from Old World End Times. Morghasts and Mortarchs basically established the core idea of skeletons built of skeletons and bone constructs as a structure for the army design. From the style of those two models came the Ossiarchs. Almost exactly the same way the Nighthaunt were a few ghost models in the Vampire army and are now their own thing (heck if anything the fact that a few ghost units remain in Soulblight is a bit odd looking when they don't have ghost units anywhere else now).


Ossiarchs were also very new because GW didn't really tease them at all pre-launch. Which I think honestly was part of what hampered their early popularity. Lumineth are well known and teased lore wise; we have loads of little teases for the Shadow Aelves too. However Ossiarchs kind of appeared as "They've always been there but no one noticed until now they are here" kind of thing. They popped up very suddenly and I think the only lore teasing was in the side game. Even then it wasn't really hinting at a whole new army as such until things got into the pre-release phase.

I still hold out that they just need another chunky release like Lumineth got to really flesh out the concept of the Ossiarchs even more. The fact that they keep appearing as Christmas and discount bundle sets suggests to me that they must be selling well enough for GW to do that.

chaos0xomega wrote:
My feeling is that Marauders (and Marauder Horsemen) get the Empire treatment ala Cities of Sigmar and get cut from the Slaves to Darkness battletom in AoS4. They will stick with the warcry cults as an alternative to marauders, and let proper marauders become a TOW thing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

Right? I'm the same way with it lol. I think its in part because theres still a lot of old WHFB models present, but also a lot of the early AoS releases were very WHFB adjacent (and could well have been WHFB sculpts that were released for a different game). Fyreslayers for example might as well be WHFB dwarf slayers, but barring a couple of the sculpts were all released in the AoS era. Many of the new Seraphon sculpts are for thing thats had rules in the WHFB era, likewise like 2/3rds of the Gloomspite gitz units are old WHFB units, half of which have had AoS resculpts, the other half are still old WHFB minis. Flesh Eater Courts are an outlier, as the majority of the minis to date are legacy WHFB sculpts, and the new wave thats coming out are all new units that never existed in WHFB with only one actual resculpt (Varghulf) of an hold WHFB mini.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Overread wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't know what it is between AoS and me, I keep feeling like it's not getting any substantial releases while I unpack my boxes of full Seraphon range overhaul, modernized Night Goblins, new Flesh-eaters etc.

I know what you mean and I think its simply because the game has a lot of factions that are "half" size or which are still in need of a massive range update.

I think it just shows how massive a hole AoS had in terms of army updates, esp when we honestly don't consider it a 5-7 year old game but a 35-40 year old game (because most of the armies are from Old World). Plus how many armies got broken down into tiny fragments of what they were before.


Take Death - the entire GA of Death is basically 1 single army from Old World broken into 4 parts. What was once one massive army is now fragmented into 4. Which means to bulk those up GW has to do 4X the work to get there. Now they've done really well - Nighthaunt and Soulblight feel very fleshed out; Flesheaters are getting some well needed attention now and Ossiarchs had a strong start, but I'd really love to see them get a nice chunky update. Perhaps a point and stat reduction to allow for a chunky update otherwise they'd run the risk of being an elite army that can't take many of their toys to the table.

Thats true of Soulblight Gravelords, Nighthaunt, and Flesh-Eater Courts... but Ossiarch Bonereapers? They are one of a handful of born and bred AoS factions and weren't spun off of VC at all. They are more a replacement for Tomb Kings than anything to do with the old VC army. Yes, they have skeleton warriors, but of a pretty distinct and different flavor from the actual VC skeleton analogue within Soulblight.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
I could see new ones being Darkoath specific in style and then the old being kicked over.

...you mean... Darkoath Savagers? They already exist.

As a proper full on kit, not a Warcry specific one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Overread wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:

Thats true of Soulblight Gravelords, Nighthaunt, and Flesh-Eater Courts... but Ossiarch Bonereapers? They are one of a handful of born and bred AoS factions and weren't spun off of VC at all. They are more a replacement for Tomb Kings than anything to do with the old VC army. Yes, they have skeleton warriors, but of a pretty distinct and different flavor from the actual VC skeleton analogue within Soulblight.

Yes and no. The concept of them is AoS, but the designs for them are from Old World End Times. Morghasts and Mortarchs basically established the core idea of skeletons built of skeletons and bone constructs as a structure for the army design. From the style of those two models came the Ossiarchs. Almost exactly the same way the Nighthaunt were a few ghost models in the Vampire army and are now their own thing (heck if anything the fact that a few ghost units remain in Soulblight is a bit odd looking when they don't have ghost units anywhere else now).


Ossiarchs were also very new because GW didn't really tease them at all pre-launch. Which I think honestly was part of what hampered their early popularity. Lumineth are well known and teased lore wise; we have loads of little teases for the Shadow Aelves too. However Ossiarchs kind of appeared as "They've always been there but no one noticed until now they are here" kind of thing. They popped up very suddenly and I think the only lore teasing was in the side game. Even then it wasn't really hinting at a whole new army as such until things got into the pre-release phase.

I still hold out that they just need another chunky release like Lumineth got to really flesh out the concept of the Ossiarchs even more. The fact that they keep appearing as Christmas and discount bundle sets suggests to me that they must be selling well enough for GW to do that.

I think you have to go with the idea that anything designed for the end times was properly designed for AoS and just had a brief stint on squares.

That would be my take (Mortachs and Nagash designed for AoS, made a stint in WHFB to bridge the gap). Also, its my recollection that they weren't really "Vampire Count" units in The End Times, were they? They were generic "Death" units that IIRC worked for both VC and Tomb Kings as part of the combined mish-mash grand army thing they were doing at the time with the various factions.

Going back to Darkoath Savagers - I dont really see what the distinction between "a proper full on kit" and a "Warcry specific one" are. They have rules in the Slaves to Darkness battletome, which is really the only thing that matters. Its no different from Death Korps of Krieg in 40k, would you say they aren't a proper unit or whatever because they don't have a proper full on kit because they are sold in Kill Team branded packaging? Because I wouldn't.

Warcry VS regular kit has got some distinctions

A regular infantry kit would be just infantry; a leader model and possibly optional parts for banner/icon/musician leaders.

Meanwhile Warcry kits might feature less "troops" and fewer generic and more specific; with an increase in the number of models that can be totally unique.



Granted when they get StD stats they are simplified a lot, but there is a distinct difference.
It can make them a bit more messy on the wargame side of things; even if it might just be one extra attack or health point here and there. They are still a bit more complex than a standard troop block.

Basically what Overread said.

Also on a side note, the models with the pistols and the lamp are Callis and Toll. The swordhilt and the manbun have been identified.

I think thats splitting hairs personally. I would be surprised if GW releases a generic "Darkoath marauders" kit that would otherwise be so conceptually similar to the savagers in appearance and function.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Basically what Overread said.

Also on a side note, the models with the pistols and the lamp are Callis and Toll. The swordhilt and the manbun have been identified.

Sounds like goodies for a Dawnbringers book...

So are we thinking the boot from the Christmas rumor engine is dark oath too?

Also do we need Callis and Toll? We have so many named witch hunters but no generic versions

 GaroRobe wrote:
So are we thinking the boot from the Christmas rumor engine is dark oath too?

Also do we need Callis and Toll? We have so many named witch hunters but no generic versions

With Hexbane's Hunters being part of "Order of Azyr" for Warcry, I'm really hoping we at least get a Warcry box with a generic Witch Hunter as the leader and various henchmen this year.

 Sabotage! wrote:

 GaroRobe wrote:
So are we thinking the boot from the Christmas rumor engine is dark oath too?

Also do we need Callis and Toll? We have so many named witch hunters but no generic versions

With Hexbane's Hunters being part of "Order of Azyr" for Warcry, I'm really hoping we at least get a Warcry box with a generic Witch Hunter as the leader and various henchmen this year.

I'm hoping we never, ever get that.

Inquisitors having generic options is annoying enough. We don't need that crap in AoS. Let the Order of Azyr be a League of Extraordinary Gentlefolk.

Why? There are easily thousands of Inquisitors, and probably as many witch hunters.

It’s not like they’re god-tier heroes or are so insanely rare or so powerful that they would almost never appear on the tabletop. It’s no different than having generic HQ options. People like to convert up their own stuff instead of relying on named characters who probably have a harder time justifying their inclusion into a tabletop list

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Sabotage! wrote:

 GaroRobe wrote:
So are we thinking the boot from the Christmas rumor engine is dark oath too?

Also do we need Callis and Toll? We have so many named witch hunters but no generic versions

With Hexbane's Hunters being part of "Order of Azyr" for Warcry, I'm really hoping we at least get a Warcry box with a generic Witch Hunter as the leader and various henchmen this year.

I'm hoping we never, ever get that.

Inquisitors having generic options is annoying enough. We don't need that crap in AoS. Let the Order of Azyr be a League of Extraordinary Gentlefolk.

Ah yes. Couple inquisitors are obviously cloned in their thousands to fill up the thousands roaming Sigmar's realms

Too many special characters already.

tneva82 wrote:

Ah yes. Couple inquisitors are obviously cloned in their thousands to fill up the thousands roaming Sigmar's realms

Right, because a "Build Your Own Inquisitor/Order of Azyr Agent" setup won't end up being netlisted at all...

AH YES! The Infamous Inquisitor <Insert Name Here>, carrying the venerable Sword of Smites The Things!

Too many special characters already.

Certainly an interesting take to have, considering they're supposed to be special characters in and of themselves.

 Kanluwen wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Ah yes. Couple inquisitors are obviously cloned in their thousands to fill up the thousands roaming Sigmar's realms

Right, because a "Build Your Own Inquisitor/Order of Azyr Agent" setup won't end up being netlisted at all...

Yes, the perfect reason to eliminate options for the player.

 Shakalooloo wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Ah yes. Couple inquisitors are obviously cloned in their thousands to fill up the thousands roaming Sigmar's realms

Right, because a "Build Your Own Inquisitor/Order of Azyr Agent" setup won't end up being netlisted at all...

Yes, the perfect reason to eliminate options for the player.

lol, what options?


There's 3 "main" groups of the Order of Azyr:
-Stakesmen, nullstone specialists in anti-magic.
-Pyremen, traitor-hunters
-Maskbreakers, the rarest of all and specialists in hunting shapeshifters.

There's literally ONE of those groups that is relevant to the lore and game in the form of Stakesmen. The others are effectively RP fodder.

Now, if you want to argue that Order of Azyr should have a unit of "spellhunters"(a thing mentioned that Stakesmen lead)? Cool, I'm game.

But no generics, no full subfaction. It would just be making the Sigperium Sigquisition.

You can let different games be different.

Steering away from this line of conversation somewhat, i wonder what the second video will be? Tomb kings obviously for the old world second, but i'm curious what it'll be for AoS.

Might just be a big ol' Dawnbringer tease.

Would be a bit odd when 4 hasn't hit the shelves yet.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Would be a bit odd when 4 hasn't hit the shelves yet.

That's the reveal I'm referring to...

The Nulahmian is coming with that book. We know there's Regiments of Renown for the Mortarchs. Callis and Toll likely are coming as part of it as well.

I think that would probably be for book 5 more. We've already seen 4 with Ushoran and probably the FEC's full release along with it. I could well be wrong, but i think 4 is going to be FEC dominated along with snake vamp.