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RedNoak wrote:
@tednugent
hognob doesnt have dev wounds though?
he just gives out +1 to hit



i still think moz is the better option than generic beastboss on squig.
4++ instead of 5++
+1 damage in general (+2 vs mon/vehicle and +3 vs titanic)
chompaz devastating wounds proc on 5+ vs 6+

on the other hand there is reroll charges and the HWKC (4+ devastating wounds) for generic Beastboss...

pointswise thei're both pretty close... 195 vs 185 (with HWKC)

Can't you just give the HWKC to the nob on smasha? It only says ork model, and he's a character.

With 5 base attacks and 3+ anti vehicle/monster on waagh, and he can join a unit, why not give it to him?

TedNugentwas sepaking about Hognob with HWKC. Which makes sence. Hognob is bodyguarded by hogboyz

ok get it, yeah i think i'm gonna try that out...

now the only problem is... HOW THE HELL DO I FIT THE POINTS FOR THE HWKC IN MY LIST?! its not like i can drop a model or an upgrade for it

EDIT:
btw...today i mathed out my first ever list in10th... landed spot on 1500 points on the first try^^ (no room for HWKC sadly)

 Tomsug wrote:
That is the smallest issue. Warbikers were masacred to the dust. Their shooting is down to half, their move down from 20” to 15,5”, no -1 to hit. Same price. What have they done to my boyz?

Sorry, but that is not true. Dakka guns used to be just 2x dakka 5/3 which meant that you could never shoot them when advancing.

Now dakka guns are 3 shots rapidfire 2 (so same as in 9th), but gained assault and twin-linked and 1 point of AP if you are within rapid fire range which you want to be anyways.
So, in fact, they moved up from 14" movement to 15.5" and are at least somewhat equivalent in shooting - in a context where all comparable units have lost power.

As for exhaust cloud - they got +1 to toughness and a 6++ instead, which is a perfectly fine replacement.

I have no issues with complaints, but do your homework first by at least checking the datasheets of 9th and 10th against each other.

 Jidmah wrote:
I just now noticed warbikers went down to max 6 per units. Holy crap!

My condolences to the speed freeks among you who had multiple full mobs of them before, GW did you dirty.

Yuuup, it hurts. I used to have enough to field 3 full squads of 12 back in the day. They became crap for a long time, got dropped to 9 models per unit then down further to 6. At least now they seem to be okay, you can cover a lot of ground with a wartrike, waagh and the 2" move trait.

Shame there's no big mek on bike..... GW!

Don't forget the buffs/debuffs we have gotten to go along side them. Something threatening the bikes in shooting? Fire a Kustom boosta blasta for suppressed. If you don't go full speed you could also have a Snazz wagon snug up next to the enemy units to pass out a -1 to hit in combat and ranged.

 Jidmah wrote:

 Tomsug wrote:
That is the smallest issue. Warbikers were masacred to the dust. Their shooting is down to half, their move down from 20” to 15,5”, no -1 to hit. Same price. What have they done to my boyz?

Sorry, but that is not true. Dakka guns used to be just 2x dakka 5/3 which meant that you could never shoot them when advancing.

Now dakka guns are 3 shots rapidfire 2 (so same as in 9th), but gained assault and twin-linked and 1 point of AP if you are within rapid fire range which you want to be anyways.
So, in fact, they moved up from 14" movement to 15.5" and are at least somewhat equivalent in shooting - in a context where all comparable units have lost power.

As for exhaust cloud - they got +1 to toughness and a 6++ instead, which is a perfectly fine replacement.

I have no issues with complaints, but do your homework first by at least checking the datasheets of 9th and 10th against each other.

agree. warbike shooting is almost the exat same output (within 9") as non-speedwaaagh 9th.
now if they are worth it in 10th is another matter. I think they can have a role to play, killing backfield light inf. score points and screen out deepstrikes ect. They are dirt cheap compared to alot of units we have now

i agree the lost of smoke cloud is fine due to the toughness and fnp, also theyre...shockingly cheap...

But i do think their shooting is not equiv to before.
They have half the number of shots as before but have reroll to wound now. Twinlinked being reroll wound instead of hit annoys me to no end, both because i'd rather reroll to hit anyway and also memory is going to screw with me.
Also...30k still has twinlinked as reroll hits too. And i play both. Im totally not going to get that confused.

Ard as nails is also a fun thing to stack on. Such a shame it's not on vehicles though.

But a lot of our infantry can really stack durability, pretty much forcing the enemy to wound on 6s due to the common T5. Only really Lethal hits allows the enemy to get around it easily.

Theres also anti-infantry, which the designer commentary mentions wins vs minus to wound mechanics.
But off hand im not aware of any bulk anti-infantry right now.

 Jidmah wrote:

 Tomsug wrote:
That is the smallest issue. Warbikers were masacred to the dust. Their shooting is down to half, their move down from 20” to 15,5”, no -1 to hit. Same price. What have they done to my boyz?

Sorry, but that is not true. Dakka guns used to be just 2x dakka 5/3 which meant that you could never shoot them when advancing.

Now dakka guns are 3 shots rapidfire 2 (so same as in 9th), but gained assault and twin-linked and 1 point of AP if you are within rapid fire range which you want to be anyways.
So, in fact, they moved up from 14" movement to 15.5" and are at least somewhat equivalent in shooting - in a context where all comparable units have lost power.

As for exhaust cloud - they got +1 to toughness and a 6++ instead, which is a perfectly fine replacement.

I have no issues with complaints, but do your homework first by at least checking the datasheets of 9th and 10th against each other.

9th - Squad of 3 drive 14” to dakka range, shots 30 on 5+ = 10 hits - into GEQ/MEQ wounds on 3+ = 6,66 wounds with ap-1 because of Speedwaagh (after 2 turns dead anyway).
10th - Squad of 3 drive 15,5” to assault rapid range, shot 15 on 5+ = 5 hits - into GEQ/MEQ wounds on 3 with full reroll = 3,33+2,22 = 5,55 wounds with the same Ap.

Reagrding the Exhausts cloud - there was more invu because of Speedwaagh, but it' s one turn of 6++ difference.

In another words - you are right, sorry. My fault.
Only significant issue is the speed. 3 warbikers - standard 9th unit size - was great roadblocks / objective grabers for few points with 20”. Now they are down to 15,5”, which is a big different. But no as bad as I said.

What is super hard for me to judge now is the meaning of T and the killines of shooting in comparison to another armies. Maybe, this is a great shooting now. I don' t know. Everybody around screams about about how bad their armies are now but the general judgement is propably as good as my previous about warbikers I guess…



Automatically Appended Next Post:

cody.d. wrote:
Ard as nails is also a fun thing to stack on. Such a shame it's not on vehicles though.

But a lot of our infantry can really stack durability, pretty much forcing the enemy to wound on 6s due to the common T5. Only really Lethal hits allows the enemy to get around it easily.

Ard as Nails = -1 to wound
Smokescreen = -1 to hit (+ cover)
Go to ground = 6++ (+cover)
—————————————
For 3 CP however…

 Tomsug wrote:

Spoiler:

 Jidmah wrote:

 Tomsug wrote:
That is the smallest issue. Warbikers were masacred to the dust. Their shooting is down to half, their move down from 20” to 15,5”, no -1 to hit. Same price. What have they done to my boyz?

Sorry, but that is not true. Dakka guns used to be just 2x dakka 5/3 which meant that you could never shoot them when advancing.

Now dakka guns are 3 shots rapidfire 2 (so same as in 9th), but gained assault and twin-linked and 1 point of AP if you are within rapid fire range which you want to be anyways.
So, in fact, they moved up from 14" movement to 15.5" and are at least somewhat equivalent in shooting - in a context where all comparable units have lost power.

As for exhaust cloud - they got +1 to toughness and a 6++ instead, which is a perfectly fine replacement.

I have no issues with complaints, but do your homework first by at least checking the datasheets of 9th and 10th against each other.

9th - Squad of 3 drive 14” to dakka range, shots 30 on 5+ = 10 hits - into GEQ/MEQ wounds on 3+ = 6,66 wounds with ap-1 because of Speedwaagh (after 2 turns dead anyway).
10th - Squad of 3 drive 15,5” to assault rapid range, shot 15 on 5+ = 5 hits - into GEQ/MEQ wounds on 3 with full reroll = 3,33+2,22 = 5,55 wounds with the same Ap.

Reagrding the Exhausts cloud - there was more invu because of Speedwaagh, but it' s one turn of 6++ difference.

In another words - you are right, sorry. My fault.
Only significant issue is the speed. 3 warbikers - standard 9th unit size - was great roadblocks / objective grabers for few points with 20”. Now they are down to 15,5”, which is a big different. But no as bad as I said.

What is super hard for me to judge now is the meaning of T and the killines of shooting in comparison to another armies. Maybe, this is a great shooting now. I don' t know. Everybody around screams about about how bad their armies are now but the general judgement is propably as good as my previous about warbikers I guess…

Automatically Appended Next Post:

cody.d. wrote:
Ard as nails is also a fun thing to stack on. Such a shame it's not on vehicles though.

But a lot of our infantry can really stack durability, pretty much forcing the enemy to wound on 6s due to the common T5. Only really Lethal hits allows the enemy to get around it easily.

Ard as Nails = -1 to wound
Smokescreen = -1 to hit (+ cover)
Go to ground = 6++ (+cover)
—————————————
For 3 CP however…

They already have an invul though. And it gets better on waaagh. Honestly I'd prefer to use some of the vehicle's accuracy buffs, more versatile until they get blown up of course. Keep those CP for other stuff.

But 85pts for a KBB and -1 to hit on a unit feels like good value, especially cause it works on anything, up to and including superheavies by the looks of things. For when you want your stompa to win a shootout with a Casttalen. Apply KBB and a mek. NOW WE ALL HIT ON 4s!

Every time i try to put a list together, i find myself thinking: Where the hell are all my models?

I havent played a single game of 10th yet so maybe everyone is thinking that themselves. And maybe everyone just have fewer models on the board. I dont know.

Or maybe i have too many leaders. Im not sure

Beardedragon wrote:
Every time i try to put a list together, i find myself thinking: Where the hell are all my models?

I havent played a single game of 10th yet so maybe everyone is thinking that themselves. And maybe everyone just have fewer models on the board. I dont know.

Or maybe i have too many leaders. Im not sure

At least you can build a whole list.
Apparently I need to wait until sometime after the 24th for the FW index as the core of my force is Grot Tanks & Mega-Tanks.

I've read the mek gun reroll mechanic a few times and still see people online saying it means reroll 1s.

I read it as a single die of 1 can be rerolled. If this is the case, it could be read as 1 die per unit or 1 per model.

Anyone have an alternative interpretation?

Tittliewinks22 wrote:
I've read the mek gun reroll mechanic a few times and still see people online saying it means reroll 1s.

I read it as a single die of 1 can be rerolled. If this is the case, it could be read as 1 die per unit or 1 per model.

Anyone have an alternative interpretation?

It comes clear when you remember attacks are individual. d6 attacks resuls in 3, that's do attack, do attack, do attack. Now that's 3 times you are doing attack and as rule says each time you do attack...


We roll all together for sake of speed but the core is individual attacks rollgng to hit, wound, save, damage, proceed to next attack.

tneva82 wrote:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:
I've read the mek gun reroll mechanic a few times and still see people online saying it means reroll 1s.

I read it as a single die of 1 can be rerolled. If this is the case, it could be read as 1 die per unit or 1 per model.

Anyone have an alternative interpretation?

It comes clear when you remember attacks are individual. d6 attacks resuls in 3, that's do attack, do attack, do attack. Now that's 3 times you are doing attack and as rule says each time you do attack...


We roll all together for sake of speed but the core is individual attacks rollgng to hit, wound, save, damage, proceed to next attack.

So what is your interpretation? All 1s? one 1 for the unit? One 1 per model?

EDIT:
Looking ad Baddruks reroll it says "reroll the hit roll" which implies all.
But mek rerolls are "reroll a hitroll of 1" which is more open to interpretation imo, just looking for clarity

More Dakka: While this model is leading a unit, each time a
model in that unit makes a ranged attack, re-roll a Hit roll of 1.

Yeah, it's reroll 1's to hit, just GW amazing writing skills. If it were only one it would specify, there are some that do " reroll 1 hit roll, 1 wound roll etc..."

I have to say, while i can see some use to the bikes as point stealers, unless we get a detachment for shooting, i rather use a shockattack dragsta for point stealing, since it can be anywhere in the map and pretty much same cost

What are your thoughts on the deffkilla wartrike with the bikes? I love the model.

Tittliewinks22 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Tittliewinks22 wrote:
I've read the mek gun reroll mechanic a few times and still see people online saying it means reroll 1s.

I read it as a single die of 1 can be rerolled. If this is the case, it could be read as 1 die per unit or 1 per model.

Anyone have an alternative interpretation?

It comes clear when you remember attacks are individual. d6 attacks resuls in 3, that's do attack, do attack, do attack. Now that's 3 times you are doing attack and as rule says each time you do attack...


We roll all together for sake of speed but the core is individual attacks rollgng to hit, wound, save, damage, proceed to next attack.

So what is your interpretation? All 1s? one 1 for the unit? One 1 per model?

EDIT:
Looking ad Baddruks reroll it says "reroll the hit roll" which implies all.
But mek rerolls are "reroll a hitroll of 1" which is more open to interpretation imo, just looking for clarity

Since you do more than 1 attack and reroll 1's on every attack it means multiple rerolls. Every attack means every attack

You do 6 attacks, roll 6 1's.bad luck but as each of 6 attacks can reroll 1's you get to reroll all 6 dice.

Good or bad it's been consistent for 2 editions now how this rule works.

Boosykes wrote:
What are your thoughts on the deffkilla wartrike with the bikes? I love the model.

Looks like a trap IMO. The +1 to hit really doesn't anything for the unit, and getting 3 more bikers or any of the other buggies seems like a better investment in most cases.
Neither the PK nor the melta or the flamer look particularly worthwhile.

That said, I'm going to be running it on Sunday

I have no idea if this is against the thread rules, but where the hell do you guys get the secondaries and missions from? Is there a PDF file somewhere i can get?

Because currently im completely unable to play because of lacking that

Beardedragon wrote:
I have no idea if this is against the thread rules, but where the hell do you guys get the secondaries and missions from? Is there a PDF file somewhere i can get?

Because currently im completely unable to play because of lacking that

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Yeq7rRl3ZGC-izur9FmxStpl8hutihQY/view

I believe this is also a template for people to generate their cards/missions/gambits https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1yBU0RtrHiQOqY70J13GTMVe9UESXacs-ctvcqmRQ8O4/edit#gid=766745645

 Grimskul wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:
I have no idea if this is against the thread rules, but where the hell do you guys get the secondaries and missions from? Is there a PDF file somewhere i can get?

Because currently im completely unable to play because of lacking that

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Yeq7rRl3ZGC-izur9FmxStpl8hutihQY/view

I believe this is also a template for people to generate their cards/missions/gambits https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1yBU0RtrHiQOqY70J13GTMVe9UESXacs-ctvcqmRQ8O4/edit#gid=766745645

And gork decented with his green angels and said: ere you go, ya git!

Thank you friend

Beardedragon wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:
I have no idea if this is against the thread rules, but where the hell do you guys get the secondaries and missions from? Is there a PDF file somewhere i can get?

Because currently im completely unable to play because of lacking that

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Yeq7rRl3ZGC-izur9FmxStpl8hutihQY/view

I believe this is also a template for people to generate their cards/missions/gambits https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1yBU0RtrHiQOqY70J13GTMVe9UESXacs-ctvcqmRQ8O4/edit#gid=766745645

And gork decented with his green angels and said: ere you go, ya git!

Thank you friend

Always happy to help out another zogger who dun want to loot what all the other players got. Cheers!

Does anyone know when the actual cards will come out?

Because i need to figure out how much of an effort i wanna make out of turning those PDF files in to small actual cards.

Given the new way of playing missions with cards, that just makes it super difficult to get ones hands on without buying the actual cards.

I suspect GW knows this and disliked that people could just watch the stage and missions off pages like wahapedia.

Preorder next saturday, on store week later. About 12 pound per pack. Marines, imperium, chaos, xenos.

Plus mission pack if you don"t get leviathan(which includes mission pack)

I will still tell you guy's to play a game, you will be surprised how much T and cover slows down that game, also our FNP's.

Hopefully you can share thought's in models. Currently looking at nobs, squighogs, deftkoptas boyz, kill rigs and deth dreads. Also Wazboom i am still not sold on it oh and mek guns.

tneva82 wrote:
Preorder next saturday, on store week later. About 12 pound per pack. Marines, imperium, chaos, xenos.

Plus mission pack if you don"t get leviathan(which includes mission pack)

oh yea i meant the mission packs not the actual Xenos decks.

Though i will probably buy the Xenos decks too

Beardedragon wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Preorder next saturday, on store week later. About 12 pound per pack. Marines, imperium, chaos, xenos.

Plus mission pack if you don"t get leviathan(which includes mission pack)

oh yea i meant the mission packs not the actual Xenos decks.

Though i will probably buy the Xenos decks too

That too same time. And just to double check you aren't getting leviathan right? As same deck is there as well.

tneva82 wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Preorder next saturday, on store week later. About 12 pound per pack. Marines, imperium, chaos, xenos.

Plus mission pack if you don"t get leviathan(which includes mission pack)

oh yea i meant the mission packs not the actual Xenos decks.

Though i will probably buy the Xenos decks too

That too same time. And just to double check you aren't getting leviathan right? As same deck is there as well.

nah i only have orks so that box would be useless for me.


Something like this is my first list going to look like, potentially at least. Is it good? No clue what so ever. Just a different assortment of "lets see what happens and i wanna try out". And when im looking at the list i feel like: wow, i have almost nothing on the table.



or maybe this: