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Finished the 4th book in the Horus Heresy.  The book was great, not as good as the other 3 but still great.  I can't wait for book 5, Fulgrim.

Darrian

I just finished it last night as well, I thought it was a great read. I love how it alludes to the forming of certain organizations within the imperium. Great stuff in there.

Edit: I wanted to put some stuff for discussion up on the book, including some spoiler stuff and get someone elses read on it.

Spoiler, highlight to read:

Am I right to assume that the remaining Death Guard from Garro's company are what became the basis for the Grey Knights, due to the illusion of needing people of "Inquisitive Nature" to hunt down the Witch, the Heretic, and the Xenos?  I say they form the basis for the Grey Knights, as it'd explain their training in the use of True Grit, and it'd explain where there geneseed came from.

Comments?

That's actually my thought. I also liked how they neatly explained away the two rumors of what happened to garro at the end (the lord of the flies and the apothecary theories).

i would agree voodoo boy, not only that but they would need people uncorrupted by the daemon, something these guys most definately are! its an interesting theory, one that i would like to see developed, but then it all so takes away the mystery of the knights if it is expanded! grrr its another catch 22 in the 40k world!
millest

I've also read the book, and it does seem likely that the Grey Knights might be the next step....but if so, what of the previous gunth where by the Knights "may" have their Geneseed from the Emporer himself? Not to mention that it would also mean that the Grey Knights geneseed is of a corrupt origin?

ohh....how this would upset the apple cart

Posted By Delephont on 04/10/2007 4:54 AM
I've also read the book, and it does seem likely that the Grey Knights might be the next step....but if so, what of the previous gunth where by the Knights "may" have their Geneseed from the Emporer himself? Not to mention that it would also mean that the Grey Knights geneseed is of a corrupt origin?

ohh....how this would upset the apple cart

Have to disagree with you here!

What could be more un-corrupt (!) then the geneseed of marines who were able to resist the temptations that claimed their brothers AND their Primarchs?

What more proof of loyalty and ability to resist Chaos could you ask for?

I think it makes perfect sense, and is a fitting "end" for Garro and company, whose fate was previously left unknown...

Also, I was VERY pleasantly surprised by the quality of this book, especially considering Swallow's earlier works.

Yeah, I was really skeptical about the book considering how the crap he put on paper for the Blood Angels but for the first 300 pages of the book I was really impressed. It wasn't until the last 100 or so and his portrayal of Dorn that I started to not like Swallow so much again (that's probably a little harsh though - these writers are probably under some strict guidelines about how much freedom they have). All in all a good book though and a fitting part of the series.

Would have been better for Garro to actually come face to face with the emperor though but maybe its the intent to save that for another book later and I'm fine with that. It does seem pretty clear that they become Grey Knights but even that would have been a little more believable if Garro or any of those marines with him had started to exhibit some sort of psychic powers.

There's a quote in there by the Regent of Terra that, to me anyway, strongly implies that Garro and company will form the beginnings of the Inquisition, all three major branches.

I'm at work, without the book, but the Regent says something to the effect of hunting down the witch, the Xeno, the traitor, etc.

Doesn't he?

I still want to know what happens to saul tarvitz and loken? do you think the 5th book will adress Saul end atleast?

I certainly hope so!

And really, there's no way that they will NOT address Saul and Loken's fates, eventually...

**possible spoiler**


They might make Loken and Saul into the first of the Grey Knights, as they seem to be making Garro and company into the Inquisition...

**end spoiler**

(highlight to read)

 

Heres a point that no one seems to mention. Geneseed, will physically alter a human, according to the fluff. Without becoming too philosophical, the mind and body are interlinked and can not be seperated, however, ideals are external factors playing on an individual that have nothing to do with the mind/body whole!

What I'm saying is that, any old geneseed could have been used to create Grey Knights, the fact that Garro and Co seemed to disregard the lure of chaos only shows that the Imperial indoctrination had a much more profound effect on these individuals then on the others of their chapter who found Chaos to be more suitable. None of this has anything to do with Geneseed!!!

Soooo....why the big Ho Ha about Garro possibly becoming the starting block for the Grey Knights formation? He has no psychic ability, and is not more physically endowed than any other Astartes!

I think its more possible that Garro and Co formed the foundations of what later becomes the Inquisition, where by their direct contact and conflict with the ruinous powers can really be harnessed and used to guide other "Inquisitors"

......I reckon that something special would have been created specifically for the Grey Knights in order for them to stand apart from other "normal" Space Marines, as it seems silly that the Emporer would just use "basic" geneseed to create yet another chapter, that for all he knew, may just as well turn traitor at the drop of a hat. Especially when the Grey Knights mission statement is perhaps the most important mission any Astartes Chapter can undertake......the war on Chaos itself!

I quite enjoyed it, as I have the other books.

The thought that I just can't shake, because they've written in so damn well in the books, is that the Heresy is known by, and planned for by the Emperor.

He's about his "grand plan" etc.

Now, were I a gagillion year old Emperor of a vast interstellar empire with the souls of thousands of shamen in me, I'd be a wee bit pissed off if I heard of one of my sons deciding that he was better than pops. I'd impale him on the bow of an Emperor battleship and let the Dark Eldar play kickball with his happy sack.

But no, we get the 40k equivelent of Baldrick "I have a cunning plan....."

Maybe they formed the foundation of the Adeptus Custodes. Formidible warriors, unimpeachable loyalty.

Andnot being psykers would have several benefits, including no "perils of the warp" in the inner sanctum, and no "hey we only found 999 psykers for afternoon tea, shove in one of the custodes so His stomach doesn't rumble"

nope fraid not we've already heard about the sisters of silence and the custodes been mentioned in earlier books (in fact one of the characters in this book is a SoS) so they already exsist
millest

Posted By millest on 04/13/2007 12:14 PM
nope fraid not we've already heard about the sisters of silence and the custodes been mentioned in earlier books (in fact one of the characters in this book is a SoS) so they already exsist
millest

In fact, an Adeptus Custodes is also a character in "Flight..." (and it is even said that the AC are head and shoulders above "regular" marines too).

Yeah yeah, finish book, then read spoilers, then comment...

I feel Hruddish

<<Hrud noise>>

do you think they'll pick up with Garros? or just move on to another primarch? personnaly i hope they change gears and go back to Horus' view. its great reading about all the other legions involved but i would like to see the big cheese plan for Istvaan

I think the next book has to do with the Emperor's Children.

pssh, Emperors Children? you can't eat that

Yeah, next book is "Fulgrim" - the Primarch of the Emperor's Children. I'd imagine that it focuses a lot on the role of Fabius Bile and his perversion of the EC geneseed

Remeber Fulgrim tries to persuade other Primarchs to come over to Horus cause. In particular Ferrus Manus. So they need to set that up prior to the drop site massacre that's building. Great read and Garro and others seem to be the foundations of the Ordo's. Garro and his DG may not necassarily become GK's but quite possible the start of the Ordo Xenos. I could also picture Garro and the old Lunar wolf guy as early instructors/trainers of the first GK's since they have first hand knowledge on combating Daemons.

whatever it is about it has been a great series. i have found them to be of a better quality than the garden variety warhammer novel (in my humble opinion) i hope they continue a series after the hersey and show how the codex was formd and whatnot

I think that Fulgrim and Descent of Angels, are out of the timeline. So far, each book has progressed the narrative forward, getting closer to the massacre on Istvaan and the Seige of Terra. I think that Fulgrim and DoA will be studies on those two chapters/primarchs and occur out of sequence. We haven't heard anything official from BL as to the direction of the series, as far as I know.

Ozymandias, King of Kings