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 Ruglud wrote:

Jarek Ever
based on our experience,we cant win here. if you told to bend over, the best you can ask is "how much".

Indeed! I think that pretty much sums up their situation re: FOX nicely.

I'm not sure what Jarek's post of the 20thC Fox system really brings to the table.

I mean - I guess (if we assume it's a recent screen grab - no reason not to) it at least confirms they are still talking to Fox and the project is still live, and that's a good thing, but other than that, all we know is everything is still pending. It doesn't even indicate that anything is approved (reviewed might mean approved and agreed I suppose). And we can't tell which bits come under which heading, so really we're no further forward.

I guess this is probably the more important bit?

Jarek Ever
According to Fox approval tracker, the revised game components has been reviewed ( approved with no changes needed) in the USA, now UK needs to give us the green light. The Box is "reviewed with changes", but this can be quick fix . In general getting excited, finally light at the end of the tunnel?

I definitely get the impression from the recent posts that things are moving onwards and upwards, although not ready to start holding my breath yet!

 Pacific wrote:
I guess this is probably the more important bit?

Jarek Ever
According to Fox approval tracker, the revised game components has been reviewed ( approved with no changes needed) in the USA, now UK needs to give us the green light. The Box is "reviewed with changes", but this can be quick fix . In general getting excited, finally light at the end of the tunnel?

I definitely get the impression from the recent posts that things are moving onwards and upwards, although not ready to start holding my breath yet!

I guess it rather depends on how much you believe of what we've been told in the past, and whether you're prepared to just ignore the blatant miss-truths we were fed

I'd agree that there seems to be at least the impression of things moving forward, and I think we have to hope that this new found ability to give us more information is a sign that things have settled down between Prodos and Fox. Though it's interesting that it still looks they aren't supposed to be sharing this info.

Yes!! Finally!!!!!! My money is yours.

biggusdoggus wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
I guess this is probably the more important bit?

Jarek Ever
According to Fox approval tracker, the revised game components has been reviewed ( approved with no changes needed) in the USA, now UK needs to give us the green light. The Box is "reviewed with changes", but this can be quick fix . In general getting excited, finally light at the end of the tunnel?

I definitely get the impression from the recent posts that things are moving onwards and upwards, although not ready to start holding my breath yet!

I guess it rather depends on how much you believe of what we've been told in the past, and whether you're prepared to just ignore the blatant miss-truths we were fed

I'd agree that there seems to be at least the impression of things moving forward, and I think we have to hope that this new found ability to give us more information is a sign that things have settled down between Prodos and Fox. Though it's interesting that it still looks they aren't supposed to be sharing this info.

Fair points. I always tend to blame incompetence rather than maliciousness. I think most of the hold-ups we have seen so far are more to do with Prodos stumbling around in the dark with the issues of running a KS, and of the Fox licensing arrangements, and then of being very poor at communicating those stumblings.

Although, perhaps I am just being overly optimistic in hoping that at least the KS backers will have something within the next couple of months - certainly, having seen some of these minis in the flesh, it would be a crime against miniature wargaming if they were never to be released!

 Pacific wrote:


Fair points. I always tend to blame incompetence rather than maliciousness. I think most of the hold-ups we have seen so far are more to do with Prodos stumbling around in the dark with the issues of running a KS, and of the Fox licensing arrangements, and then of being very poor at communicating those stumblings.

Although, perhaps I am just being overly optimistic in hoping that at least the KS backers will have something within the next couple of months - certainly, having seen some of these minis in the flesh, it would be a crime against miniature wargaming if they were never to be released!

I think in general I'm in agreement with you there. I remain a pessimist on timescales though. 2nd quarter is my bet. I do believe it will happen. Soon ;-)

I think the most depressing thing at this point will be going to Salute, and seeing exactly the same miniatures in exactly the same positions in the cabinet, with no box set yet released and none of the Prodos staff there able to talk about when we might see it!

Yarp - if SOON(tm) isn't by Salute (24 Apr) I'll be by passing Prodos if they have the same 'prototypes' on display... Plenty of other shinies to drool over and spend my hard earned cash on

I don't think they've been showing any of the AvP miniatures at shows since everything went crazy in November, so don't hold out for seeing anything at Salute. I do hope they have a finished boxset to show off by then, but if they don't, I'd guess they won't be allowed by Fox to show off anything.

From Facebook

Rob Alderman:
Hello all!

We just wanted to update you very quickly on our progress. As you can see, by following the link below, the revised game components have been approved in the USA. This is often the longest part of the approval for any 'part' of the game so far. The UK will hopefully give us the green light in the next few days.
We really appreciate your patience so far guys and as you can see, this is really close now. We're going to call Fox on Monday and hopefully get some response from them. Of course, they may need to sit down, have a meeting about it, etc, so it may not be an immediate answer. Once we know more, we will tell you.
The box itself is 'reviewed with changes', which should be a whistlestop yes. Basically, we sent it to be approved, they pointed out some specific issues (for example, misplacement of the copyright information), we have fixed those, so they should just be looking for those issues.


Apologies for Jarek's artistry on this screenshot. I think he just got excited. In fairness, he could have drawn something much worse!

Thanks again,
Prodos Games LTD
[Note: This is the same screenshot that I posted already, so spoilered here]

Spoiler:

[/img]

Facebook comments between KS backers & Rob:

KS Backer 1:
so I see three items (or perhaps groups of item) as pending and 2 as reviewed with changes. If one of those is the box art, what are the three pendings and the other reviewed with changes items ?

Rob Alderman:
1st is the whole boxed set. If you click that link, it would show you a huge list of items
The second is the box cover.
The third is the unit/squad boxes cover.

KS Backer 1:
still like that original artwork over the newer box. It looks way classier. #justasyin

Rob Alderman:
Aye, but we were asked to change it to something 'punchier'. I like the old cover too.

Rob Alderman:
Granted, I like the new one as well!

KS Backer 1:
so everything in the box, including the rulebook, is now fully approved, signed off, and therefore either already produced or in the process of being produced (presses rolling for rulebook/tiles/cards/tokens etc) ?

and we're just waiting on minute changes to the box layout that have essentially been instructed in detail by Fox, and now done by yourselves and returned to them, and therefore you would hope will be reviewed and approved with all haste.

Am I understanding correctly?

Rob Alderman:
I think so yes, we are waiting for final green light from UK then we can start pumping these bad boys out.

KS Backer 2:
Is there a rough production timeline from "green light" to shipping?

Rob Alderman:
No, we cannot give timelines or estimates.

KS Backer 2:
understood

Rob Alderman:
In any case, I think we will know ourselves how long it will take after a week of shipping.

I think Assembly (putting stuff in the boxes) will probably be the biggest time consumer!

If assembly takes longer than approval, we're all totally fethed

Joyboozer wrote:
If assembly takes longer than approval, we're all totally fethed

Thankfully Prodos do not use restic. Cleanup and assembly can be done within our lifetimes.

biggusdoggus wrote:

Joyboozer wrote:
If assembly takes longer than approval, we're all totally fethed

Thankfully Prodos do not use restic. Cleanup and assembly can be done within our lifetimes.

Having dealt with some warzone mini's you may be being a little optimistic.

biggusdoggus wrote:

Joyboozer wrote:
If assembly takes longer than approval, we're all totally fethed

Thankfully Prodos do not use restic. Cleanup and assembly can be done within our lifetimes.

I think by "assembly" he meant "Prodos putting everything in the boxes" rather than assembling the models.

SeanDrake wrote:

biggusdoggus wrote:

Joyboozer wrote:
If assembly takes longer than approval, we're all totally fethed

Thankfully Prodos do not use restic. Cleanup and assembly can be done within our lifetimes.

Having dealt with some warzone mini's you may be being a little optimistic.

Having struggled with Sedition Wars, nothing I've seen of the Prodos minis frightens me at all.

Alex C wrote:

biggusdoggus wrote:

Joyboozer wrote:
If assembly takes longer than approval, we're all totally fethed

Thankfully Prodos do not use restic. Cleanup and assembly can be done within our lifetimes.

I think by "assembly" he meant "Prodos putting everything in the boxes" rather than assembling the models.

You may be right. Interestingly Rob Alderman posted on this very issue this weekend.

Rob Alderman In any case, I think we will know ourselves how long it will take after a week of shipping.

I think Assembly (putting stuff in the boxes) will probably be the biggest time consumer!

It might be that when they've said they'll be shipping around 50 per day (something they said during the KS) they are factoring in assembly which is why the figure is so low, but yes I agree - it's likely going to be a painfully slow process.

Hmmm, 50 a day seems pretty low if all they're doing is packing orders.

If, on the other hand, they're actually assembling the boxed games, then God save them.

50 a day would be >1000/month on a 5 day week.
They have fewer orders/backers than that. Really, <1 month delay is a drop in the sea by now.
(That is, if it ever gets that far...)

 Bolognesus wrote:
50 a day would be >1000/month on a 5 day week.
They have fewer orders/backers than that. Really, <1 month delay is a drop in the sea by now.
(That is, if it ever gets that far...)

I seem to recall they have around 2500 backers including those who bought on after the KS ended.

Well, some of those would have skipped the box, like me.

 His Master's Voice wrote:
Well, some of those would have skipped the box, like me.

true. You're in for a horribly long wait.

biggusdoggus wrote:

 Bolognesus wrote:
50 a day would be >1000/month on a 5 day week.
They have fewer orders/backers than that. Really, <1 month delay is a drop in the sea by now.
(That is, if it ever gets that far...)

I seem to recall they have around 2500 backers including those who bought on after the KS ended.

Seems you're right. My bad. That would be somewhat annoying (though still even a 3 month wait isn't that much on this timescale anymore...)

biggusdoggus wrote:

 His Master's Voice wrote:
Well, some of those would have skipped the box, like me.

true. You're in for a horribly long wait.

Every single KS I backed, I mentally added a year to the delivery date. It's working out so far.

 His Master's Voice wrote:

biggusdoggus wrote:

 His Master's Voice wrote:
Well, some of those would have skipped the box, like me.

true. You're in for a horribly long wait.

Every single KS I backed, I mentally added a year to the delivery date. It's working out so far.

Not a bad ethos, though I don't think most of the issues here are about the delays so much as the poor and often miss-leading communication mixed with the implied issues post KS implosion. In truth it's probably that everything is indeed ok, and just behind schedule, but the reality is that Prodos burnt the bridges they needed to maintain confidence by treating backers as an annoyance early on, and now almost no matter what they say, it's taken with a pinch of salt. Their only safe exit now is to deliver, and while I believe they will, the damage they've done to their company (whether through fault of their own or not) is huge.

Personally I've had my view of KS skewed by being a Battle Systems backer. I know it is perfectly possible to run a brilliant campaign, be up front and honest with backers, have nothing more than the merest of delays despite a very complicated project, and still end up barely a word of criticism being aimed at ones head. They broke the mould set by so many and proved it can be done. Despite (or perhaps because of) being only a small company of 2 guys struggling to get their vision funded and out there, they hold down real life jobs to keep their families going on top of their KS efforts, and they still manage to communicate regularly enough to make others (not just Prodos) look like incompetent amateurs. Bigger companies frankly have no excuse for their pitiful performance.

http://variety.com/2015/film/news/new-alien-movie-confirmed-at-fox-with-director-neill-blomkamp-1201436551/

I wonder if this has had anything to do with the long approval times.

 RivenSkull wrote:
http://variety.com/2015/film/news/new-alien-movie-confirmed-at-fox-with-director-neill-blomkamp-1201436551/

I wonder if this has had anything to do with the long approval times.

Could be. But all I know is that Blomkamp on an Alien movie can only mean good things.

Posted yesterday (18Feb) on Facebook:

Rob Alderman
Just spoke with the guys, they have a meeting this week to review a few of the products, we just have to sit tight until they get back to us basically. Sorry I can't report anything more positive!

 RivenSkull wrote:
http://variety.com/2015/film/news/new-alien-movie-confirmed-at-fox-with-director-neill-blomkamp-1201436551/

I wonder if this has had anything to do with the long approval times.

I doubt it, considering the movie probably doesn't even have a script yet. The problem, if one exists outside of Prodos' inexperience dealing with a license holder, more than likely stems from the whole Aliens: Colonial Marines mess.

I wonder what sort of heavy-handed social commentary the director will shovel into this movie.

 BrookM wrote:
I wonder what sort of heavy-handed social commentary the director will shovel into this movie.

If its anything like Elysium and District 9 it will be relevant and interesting.