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The super reduced combat style is probably why you have models with 10-30 wounds as well. They probably should have changed the stat from Strength/Toughness to simply 'Attack/Defense" etc. if they've done away with other considerations. Your Attack value could simply be the overall combination of your abilities/strength/equipment, etc.

I'm not seeing anything rules-wise that blows my skirt up. Seems pretty standard fare.

I'm not seeing anything rules-wise that blows my skirt up. Seems pretty standard fare.

True.
Interesting but the game is not a must-have.
On the other hand, the models are really great.
So there might be reasons to buy some factions.

Might have to invest in some of those acrylic spin dial wound counters when models have 10-20 each.

 Sqorgar wrote:

Now, I'm curious about the Runemarks. The models don't seem to have special attacks themselves (no key words, no rules, no abilities), with the specials being done by Runemarks. So every model with the same Runemark can do that ability. Are there models with multiple Runemarks? The Chaotic Beasts, which we know you can add to your warband at some point, use the same Runemarks - does that mean the warband inherits these abilities with the beasts? Can an Iron Golem with the right Runemarks now perform a "Cower" or "Crazed Block"? Does the Chaotic Beasts count as a warband, in and of itself? Does these mean we can add models from different warbands together?

You will note that the ability card for Iron Golems has 2 runemarks tied to each ability but the first. You need both to use the ability. And the first one is the faction runemark. It's very possible that the ability runemark graphics are the same across all factions and, for example, the flaming skull simply represents the ultimate ability for each warband - it's the combination with the faction runemark that tells you which particular ability the model has. In other words, the flaming skull on a card means "This model has the 6th Tier ability of its faction". This would explain why the graphics are so generic and in no way indicative of the ability they represent.

Strange/disappointing CC-mechanics where the targets Weapon Skill is not considered at all.

I.e. targets just stand there and brace for impact, hoping their Toughness and myriad Wounds will save them :(

Sounds like GW went with one of the worst parts of the new Necromunda ruleset - where a swift but fragile weapons master (without additional skills) always looses against a hard hitting brute...

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
Have they said what the size of a standard board will be?

According to the rules leak 22" x 30", same as KT if I remember correctly.

 Sabotage! wrote:

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
Have they said what the size of a standard board will be?

According to the rules leak 22" x 30", same as KT if I remember correctly.

Cool, thanks!

 Sabotage! wrote:

 Dakka Flakka Flame wrote:
Have they said what the size of a standard board will be?

According to the rules leak 22" x 30", same as KT if I remember correctly.

Very small if you ask me but for a board game with 6 to 12 miniatures per side it looks fine.

Small seems intentional. They way they pitched it (and I'm not up to date on the videos, so apologies if I'm talking mince as a result) is so we get straight into the face smashing.

I'm intrigued as to how lighter warbands compensate for the apparent lack of manouvering time?

A simplified combat mechanic can be nice, see Warhammer Underworlds, Kings of War, and Frostgrave.

This one seems to have missed the mark, it just feels a bit underdeveloped, however that could be because we aren't seeing the full picture yet. There may be missing rules we haven't been shown.

From a rules point of view I am not that impressed, some nice things, 2 activations per model, alternative activations, and 4 cards to determine the mission, set up, deployment, and twist.

I imagine keeping the size the same means no retooling or anything that creates said boards.

So I had a read through the pictures of the rules someone posted on Imgur. I think I like everything enough that I'm going to preorder the core set.

Some things of note:.

While the pictures don't show the faction lists for non chaos the tiny Stormcast section only shows the vanguard guys. So it's possible that image is legit. Still too early but I hope it's not crossbows and gryphhounds only for Stormcast

Alternating activation model by model. Yep. In a GW game.

You can use the doubles triples quads abilities before either of your 2 actions. There are also universal ones including having a model not close to the enemy rest and remove some damage.

The increased wounds and attacks along with crits makes me think the simplified strength vs toughness system is going to be fine. That it won't feel shallow or too simple. Combined with the way abilities work I think you're going to be able to do some cool stuff.

Battleplans generator cards assume core set terrain but you can substitute.

Jumping, climbing and not being slowed by terrain less than 1" tall makes me think the faster warbands are going to really rocket around. Falling and jumping down rules with damage being 50/50 (4+ Crit on 6) on drops over 3" makes me think that the game will really use all those platforms in the core Terran.

Missions assume you'll different your warband into 3 groups. Dagger, shield and hammer.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Small seems intentional. They way they pitched it (and I'm not up to date on the videos, so apologies if I'm talking mince as a result) is so we get straight into the face smashing.

I'm intrigued as to how lighter warbands compensate for the apparent lack of manouvering time?

Yeah, me too, after all some are described as hit-and-run and stab-slink-back-and-cackle-while-the-poison-kicks-in. Maybe they'll get some "take less/no damage after disengaging" abilities or something? Though the Iron Legionaries have no ability, so even then that wouldn't work for regular Corvus Cabal fodder. I still think some reaction cards or Blood Rage-like system to add to combat would be nice.

I'm reaaaaally looking forward to seeing the Scions. Somewhat amused that the actual gladiator warband silhouette looks like a regular WHFB marauder and not as pompous as the Splintered Fang crew.

I also glanced at the rule leak and I'm pretty happy with them. The rules have in my opinion a good balance of crunch and and simplicity. I don't want something as simple as A Song of Blades and Heroes or with a plethora of minute situational rules like Infinity.

Things I like:

The way abilities work. It's neat that there is a balance between them and initiative and I appreciate they are all unique to each warband.

There is a disengage action. I wasn't able to see the rules specifically, but one of my big qualms about GW games is not being able to leave melee.

The small board size and how missions are determined. I love that there won't be ten turns of positioning or the rangeds Teams turtling. The game seems like it gets going very quickly.

The campaign system looks pretty interesting and definitely like an upgrade over Kill Team (not so much in specialist improvement- but there is territory to hold and varieties of special missions to be played....I haven't seen the specifics of those yet. Some things I did notice were characters could get lesser or major artifacts that have various abilities and as they get more experienced they can gain more favor of the gods, which allows them access to a number of rerolls each game. The leader and a favored warrior can get special traits also.

I love the simplified action roll. No more of the rolling to hit, wound, and armor save. The simplified roll makes it look like combat will flow much smoother.

Things I did not like so far:
There doesn't seem to be a lot in the way of customization for your less important warband members.

The injury table is pretty lackluster.


Overall looks like a solid skirmish game and that it will fill exactly the niche I want it for.

Seems a bit odd that a game about small groups of warriors using rather different fighting styles has what (at present at least) appears to be an overly simplistic combat system, but an innovative system for determining initiative/special abilities. As a game, it may be interesting enough, but the extensive mechanics are not focussed on the most cinematic parts of the conflict unfolding before your eyes.

Requiring many dice rolls is not typically regarded as an advantage it seems, but it's one of my favourite things about e.g. Mordheim. Your charging terrified peasant clumsily swings at the enemy vampire. He appears to hit him! But no, the vampire ends up parrying the blow carelessly. The vampire now turns around to slay your captain before he gets to strike. The fiend's slender blade first strikes his chest, but he manages to turn it into a glancing blow by stepping out of the way, but the evil creature is not yet done, and a second savage cut goes straight for his neck, with enough force to kill him. And he finds a weak point in the armour, oh dear! The captain is not quite dead yet, but lies helplessly on the ground. Here's hoping the peasant can hold on for just a bit next turn, giving the captain time to recover...
A long series of alternating dice rolls (to hit, to wound, re-rolls, parry, step aside, helmet saves, crit tables, injury rolls) helps such a sequence come alive, to me at least. Not recommended for large-scale games, but perfect for something along these lines. In my opinion the much better place to insert interesting mechanics, like Confrontation/En Garde or whatever have for dice allocation in attack and defence.

Almost all rules so far :

https://imgur.com/a/TTavRPh

I'm having another thick....

It seems 5" is fairly standard movement. Given the play area is dinky, and indeed 3D, would 6" movement be a significant advantage or not?

 -Ekko- wrote:
Almost all rules so far :

https://imgur.com/a/TTavRPh

Leaked non-chaos units seem right, Sea aelves have Eel Rider. And Vanguard Stormcast.

Also judging by the untamed beast roster card look like they got even worse than Iron Golem as their "option" (2-handed weapons for the 2 dudes) are just cosmetic.

And that Cat/Goat hyrbrid of Untamed Beast move 8 while also tough and hit like a truck.

Thanks for the link. That rule leak gives the full picture. Campaign mode is as disappointing as I thought it would be - merely a thumbs up from Kill Team. It's very basic again, you can add as many fighters as you want to your roster, death barely matters at all and experience points...there are no experience points. They introduce a small Mordheim-inspired piece in the artifact search phase after the game. I don't see this game meant to be lasting the same, honestly - the system has barely any personnality to it.

Still good to play and enjoy for a while, though.

Man I just want the terrain. Add that to some Azyrite townscapes and ruins and I will totally have a gaming board worthy of being a ruined city!

Yeah that terrain is sweet, it's incredibly tempting.

Also sorry if I've missed it, but what size are the board/game tables going to be?

EDIT: never mind, the imgur link has it 22x30 ugh

 Coenus Scaldingus wrote:
Seems a bit odd that a game about small groups of warriors using rather different fighting styles has what (at present at least) appears to be an overly simplistic combat system, but an innovative system for determining initiative/special abilities. As a game, it may be interesting enough, but the extensive mechanics are not focussed on the most cinematic parts of the conflict unfolding before your eyes.

Requiring many dice rolls is not typically regarded as an advantage it seems, but it's one of my favourite things about e.g. Mordheim. Your charging terrified peasant clumsily swings at the enemy vampire. He appears to hit him! But no, the vampire ends up parrying the blow carelessly. The vampire now turns around to slay your captain before he gets to strike. The fiend's slender blade first strikes his chest, but he manages to turn it into a glancing blow by stepping out of the way, but the evil creature is not yet done, and a second savage cut goes straight for his neck, with enough force to kill him. And he finds a weak point in the armour, oh dear! The captain is not quite dead yet, but lies helplessly on the ground. Here's hoping the peasant can hold on for just a bit next turn, giving the captain time to recover...
A long series of alternating dice rolls (to hit, to wound, re-rolls, parry, step aside, helmet saves, crit tables, injury rolls) helps such a sequence come alive, to me at least. Not recommended for large-scale games, but perfect for something along these lines. In my opinion the much better place to insert interesting mechanics, like Confrontation/En Garde or whatever have for dice allocation in attack and defence.

Not necessarily more rolls, but anything that makes combat more interactive is good for skirmish systems, IMO.

Now, what Mordheim bands would be good fits for proxying the Warcry stuff so far They'd fit right in with CMON's HATE game, down to the red on the boxes. I haven't played it yet, though.

I like the rules quite a lot, dig the hell out of the Iron Golems and could use more home board terrain. Downside is I'm feeling pretty strapped for cash right now - summer travels + buying triple Lords of Change because I was spooked by the price increase for them - and also pretty stretched thin with too many games. I continue to invest time and energy into Kill Team, and War Cry being so similar is actually a bad thing, as I don't particularly need another identically-sized skirmish game.

That said, that starter is a good deal and, coming from KT's release, I know every box GW puts out for WC won't last long past release. I feel like I have to preorder the WC starter this weekend if I ever want it, which both pressures me to do it while also heavily turning me off from getting into the game. Now isn't a great time for me to start playing WC ... but knowing Dub's splash release idiocy I basically have to decide immediately

(Current plan is to try to sell some things to make cash + space to put the WC box on the shelf ...)

My main question is: why make the injury chart a 2D6 roll but only have three results?!

Voss wrote:

 Hanskrampf wrote:

 -Ekko- wrote:

That's about the variety I expected :(

More than I expected, to be honest. I was expecting most to be somewhere between savage orcs and flesh eaters.

What are "Moonclan Grots", as that doesn't correspond to any box that I see on the GW site? (Unlike Squig Hoppers and Squig Herd)

Is it just normal grots? And can you mix and match any amount of all 3 boxes to form a warband?

Thanks for any tips

You can't get a 1 in 12 odds on 1d6 but you can on 2d6


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As for that image, it's just something people were sharing on a mobile chat app. We'll find out the actual contents of those cards when a reliable source posts them. The image could turn out to be correct but maybe not

 RiTides wrote:

What are "Moonclan Grots", as that doesn't correspond to any box that I see on the GW site? (Unlike Squig Hoppers and Squig Herd)

Is it just normal grots? And can you mix and match any amount of all 3 boxes to form a warband?

Thanks for any tips

Stabbas or Shootas (it’s the same box) collectively known as Moonclan Grots https://www.games-workshop.com/en-IE/Gloomspite-Gitz-Grots-2019

Based on the rulebook leak that other factions list looks accurate although I hope there’s more

 RiTides wrote:
What are "Moonclan Grots", as that doesn't correspond to any box that I see on the GW site? (Unlike Squig Hoppers and Squig Herd)

What used to be Night Goblins, presumably?

They're "Moonclan", "Grots" and have been subdivided into Shootas and Stabbas both in store and on their warscrolls. But that should be them.

I am actually urprised that Squig hoppers (and Akhelian Guard) are listed as one of the kits available for Warcry considering those are technically cavalry.

Well maybe not Squig Hoppers considering those are just squigs with add on goblin on top.

 frozenwastes wrote:

As for that image, it's just something people were sharing on a mobile chat app. We'll find out the actual contents of those cards when a reliable source posts them. The image could turn out to be correct but maybe not

There's literally pictures in the Imgur of those items in the WarCry book fighting against Iron Golems/Untamed Beasts...unless since it was just randomly shared those aren't "reliable sources" either?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DaveC wrote:

Stabbas or Shootas (it’s the same box) collectively known as Moonclan Grots https://www.games-workshop.com/en-IE/Gloomspite-Gitz-Grots-2019

Based on the rulebook leak that other factions list looks accurate although I hope there’s more

I'd imagine that as other factions are added, there will be units for the 'launch' factions as well ala Kill Team.

I like the core rules, they are streamlined in a good way, but I fear there might not be enough meat on the bones to give a good play experience, neither in battles (not enough fighter variety, special moves, etc.) nor in the campaign phase (very limited scope for progression). It's not as bad as I feared and should play fine for a little while but it might not hold players' interest for very long. And it's hard to get invested in your warband when the only difference between your Iron Golems and your mate's Iron Golems are the names and fluff you got on the random personality generator.