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Hmm. I might have to get that warband just to have that Ogre.
That's a extremely nice character model.

Not interested in the Fish'n'Fire box, but the Ogor might be a nice additional hero in Cursed City, looking what might had happened to his Kosargi mates.

 Dryaktylus wrote:
Not interested in the Fish'n'Fire box, but the Ogor might be a nice additional hero in Cursed City, looking what might had happened to his Kosargi mates.

I know he's meant to be a pirate, but with only some minor conversion work, he'd be perfect for a witch hunter ogor. Just add a cap and swap out his sword with a big stake or hammer

Interestingly there are 9 Warscrolls in the box but only 8 unit options

 Dryaktylus wrote:
Not interested in the Fish'n'Fire box, but the Ogor might be a nice additional hero in Cursed City, looking what might had happened to his Kosargi mates.

Same. I don't think that box is going to sell well at all.

 Dysartes wrote:
I know it's a very minor thing, but the Fyreslayers and Idoneth should've been the other way round in the preview photo - as it is, both the new heroes are very carefully avoiding looking at each other...

That seems to happen a lot with these battle boxes. Lelith and the Palatine were fighting back to back...

Will be interesting to see the price. Like I said earlier, I'm not interested so it makes no difference to me, but the last 40k box was 140€. This box seems to have an additional unit on both sides. I wonder if they'll try to make them more appealing by keeping the price and thus offering a higher discount, or if they go with a bigger price tag.

At least compared to the aforementioned 40k box this one's model count looks nice and substantial.

 Matrindur wrote:
Interestingly there are 9 Warscrolls in the box but only 8 unit options

Thrallmaster
-Namarti Reavers
-Namarti Thralls
-Allopex

Auric Flamekeeper
-Auric Hearthguard
-Hearthguard Berzerkers
-Vulkite Berzerkers

Vulkite Berzerkers and Allopex each have at least one weapon option, so that might be the mystery warscroll.

 Arbitrator wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
The box of hideously overpriced basic infantry. It better have a better discount than usual or there's no point.

What's the resale value of the half you don't want going to be? Fyreslayers have always been AoS' least popular army and not many IDK players will be thinking "boy I wish I had 20 more Namarti."

With new book likely smart to load up. Odds good they get buffed u

I'm more interested when the actual new books are coming.

The Battlebox coming before the Battletomes is a good sign, that means we're likely to see some additional kits when the release happens. I'm pretty happy to see this. I think the IDK is fine, but Fyreslayers really needed some more kits.

Sorry, but IDK need the kits more.

And bloody Endless Spells/Invocations.

tneva82 wrote:

 Arbitrator wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
The box of hideously overpriced basic infantry. It better have a better discount than usual or there's no point.

What's the resale value of the half you don't want going to be? Fyreslayers have always been AoS' least popular army and not many IDK players will be thinking "boy I wish I had 20 more Namarti."

With new book likely smart to load up. Odds good they get buffed u

The units they're dumping on the market with the new characters prior to the book release? Nah.

Sorry if this isn't completely on topic, but did they stop releasing the Warhammer Underworlds warbands as ETB without the cards for a cheaper price?

Osorios wrote:
Sorry if this isn't completely on topic, but did they stop releasing the Warhammer Underworlds warbands as ETB without the cards for a cheaper price?

The Direchasm Starter warbands were released around the time Harrowdeep went up. I don't follow the game, but I think there were changes in the new season that made it more worthwhile to keep printing the rest of the Direchasm season warbands for the time being

Prices

Fury of the Deep £105, €140, $170
Blackpowders Buccaneers £25, €32.50, $40

I Might get a FotD at £84 if only for 2 warcry warbands I don’t have.

That's actually a very good price for FotD, especially after discounts. I'm more than half tempted.

 Sasori wrote:
The Battlebox coming before the Battletomes is a good sign, that means we're likely to see some additional kits when the release happens. I'm pretty happy to see this. I think the IDK is fine, but Fyreslayers really needed some more kits.

Didn’t the other times they’ve done these box then book releases, just have the exclusive characters from in here then get a normal release with the book?

Well we still have this, which screams Fyreslayers

 Kanluwen wrote:
Sorry, but IDK need the kits more.

And bloody Endless Spells/Invocations.

Looking at the online store, they both need new kits, but I'd give "more" to the Fyreslayers - though I'll grant you that the Idoneth should have Endless Spells (or equivalent).

In terms of kits (as opposed to units made from kits), Idoneth seem to have 1 Infantry unit, 1 Cavalry unit, 2 Monster kits (Leviadon & Allopex), 4 Infantry characters and 2 Monster characters, as well as a terrain piece and an Underworld warband (still packaged as an Underworlds item, so not showing on their page in the AOS section for me).

Fyreslayers appear to have a terrain piece, Endless spells, an Underworld warband, 2 Infantry units, 4 Infantry characters (plus Gotrek - is he a Fyreslayer now?) and 1 Monster character. They're effectively 2 Monster kits and a Monster character kit behind, though I acknowledge that such unit might not be the best fit for Slayers - either way, they're either two or three kits behind Idoneth already, depending on how Gotrek counts. And that's ignoring that the Berserker kit appears to only make one unit (though one with weapon options), while both the Infantry and Cavalry units for Idoneth make two units each.

Gotrek is not a Fyreslayer - he hates them

 Kanluwen wrote:
Sorry, but IDK need the kits more.

And bloody Endless Spells/Invocations.

As the poster above said, this is nonsense. Idk have six non hero units. Fyreslayers have 3 which all look almost the same.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Sorry, but IDK need the kits more.

And bloody Endless Spells/Invocations.

You realize right not every faction gets those? It's not even "old book" because there are 2nd ed and 3rd ed books without those.

 Mr Morden wrote:
Gotrek is not a Fyreslayer - he hates them

Good to know - wonder why he has been put in there on the webstore, then?

 Dysartes wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Sorry, but IDK need the kits more.

And bloody Endless Spells/Invocations.

In terms of kits (as opposed to units made from kits), Idoneth seem to have 1 Infantry unit, 1 Cavalry unit, 2 Monster kits (Leviadon & Allopex), 4 Infantry characters and 2 Monster characters, as well as a terrain piece and an Underworld warband (still packaged as an Underworlds item, so not showing on their page in the AOS section for me).

Idoneth Namarti are 2 different kits so its 2 Infantry units but each only builds one unit

Gotrek is basically a generic order hero. He doesn't fit into any single faction, however he can be taken by any army willing to pay the points cost for him.

He's probably in Fyreslayers because he is a slayer and visually its likely an easy place to put him as GW doesn't have a "non faction specific" section of the order faction and if they did it would just be him



MOST armies also have Endless Spells; those which don't tend to be outliers/exceptions to the normal. It's a bit like how armies shouldn't have any finecast nor metal - yes its happening; yes its probably because GW is "design led" and no one on the team has wanted to make them or somesuch - but in theory they should all have them. Same as terrain features.


Eg DoK went through all of 2.0 without a terrain feature nor endless spells and gained the latter only in 3.0. Meanwhile Cities of Sigmar didn't get any of either but then again it was a "rescue" battletome that was basically done as a project by in-house staff on a whim; so chances are GW just didn't have anything ready.

Not sure why some armies like Orruks wound up without any, but sometimes GW moves in strange and odd ways .

 Overread wrote:
MOST armies also have Endless Spells; those which don't tend to be outliers/exceptions to the normal. It's a bit like how armies shouldn't have any finecast nor metal - yes its happening; yes its probably because GW is "design led" and no one on the team has wanted to make them or somesuch - but in theory they should all have them. Same as terrain features.

Sure would be nice to get some Nurgle ones.

 Dysartes wrote:

Looking at the online store, they both need new kits, but I'd give "more" to the Fyreslayers - though I'll grant you that the Idoneth should have Endless Spells (or equivalent).

In terms of kits (as opposed to units made from kits), Idoneth seem to have 1 Infantry unit, 1 Cavalry unit, 2 Monster kits (Leviadon & Allopex), 4 Infantry characters and 2 Monster characters, as well as a terrain piece and an Underworld warband (still packaged as an Underworlds item, so not showing on their page in the AOS section for me).

Someone else already pointed out, but the Namarti are two separate kits. The parts aren't interchangeable without significant work either being bared flesh.

Allopex lost its "Monster" status with BR Morathi and have never regained it, unless it was in a printed publication like General's Handbook. The Akhelian King/Volturnos on Deepmare also are not actually considered Monsters. Nor are the Aspects.

Fyreslayers appear to have a terrain piece, Endless spells, an Underworld warband, 2 Infantry units, 4 Infantry characters (plus Gotrek - is he a Fyreslayer now?) and 1 Monster character. They're effectively 2 Monster kits and a Monster character kit behind, though I acknowledge that such unit might not be the best fit for Slayers - either way, they're either two or three kits behind Idoneth already, depending on how Gotrek counts. And that's ignoring that the Berserker kit appears to only make one unit (though one with weapon options), while both the Infantry and Cavalry units for Idoneth make two units each.

The Vulkite Berserker kit makes one unit with two different weapon options but the Auric Hearthguard kit also makes the Hearthguard Berzerkers(who have two weapon options themselves).

Also that "Monster character" kit for Fyreslayers? It makes 3 different heroes. If you're making an Auric Runesmiter on foot, you get to also build either a Runeson or Runefather on foot and then one of either of those two on Magmadroth. With zero conversion effort needed, because the parts are in the kit.
And the Endless Spells+terrain piece both came out with their updated battletome. Which was a thing they got.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Spoiler:

 Dysartes wrote:

Looking at the online store, they both need new kits, but I'd give "more" to the Fyreslayers - though I'll grant you that the Idoneth should have Endless Spells (or equivalent).

In terms of kits (as opposed to units made from kits), Idoneth seem to have 1 Infantry unit, 1 Cavalry unit, 2 Monster kits (Leviadon & Allopex), 4 Infantry characters and 2 Monster characters, as well as a terrain piece and an Underworld warband (still packaged as an Underworlds item, so not showing on their page in the AOS section for me).

Someone else already pointed out, but the Namarti are two separate kits. The parts aren't interchangeable without significant work either being bared flesh.

Allopex lost its "Monster" status with BR Morathi and have never regained it, unless it was in a printed publication like General's Handbook. The Akhelian King/Volturnos on Deepmare also are not actually considered Monsters. Nor are the Aspects.

Fyreslayers appear to have a terrain piece, Endless spells, an Underworld warband, 2 Infantry units, 4 Infantry characters (plus Gotrek - is he a Fyreslayer now?) and 1 Monster character. They're effectively 2 Monster kits and a Monster character kit behind, though I acknowledge that such unit might not be the best fit for Slayers - either way, they're either two or three kits behind Idoneth already, depending on how Gotrek counts. And that's ignoring that the Berserker kit appears to only make one unit (though one with weapon options), while both the Infantry and Cavalry units for Idoneth make two units each.

The Vulkite Berserker kit makes one unit with two different weapon options but the Auric Hearthguard kit also makes the Hearthguard Berzerkers(who have two weapon options themselves).

Also that "Monster character" kit for Fyreslayers? It makes 3 different heroes. If you're making an Auric Runesmiter on foot, you get to also build either a Runeson or Runefather on foot and then one of either of those two on Magmadroth. With zero conversion effort needed, because the parts are in the kit.
And the Endless Spells+terrain piece both came out with their updated battletome. Which was a thing they got.

I'm amused that you think any of what you put there was actually working against my overall point, Kan - if anything, you've strengthened it. Also, the use of "Monster" was more of a colloquial one that a rules-based one - couldn't think of a better term for "two Elves and a trident launcher jump a shark" in the case of the Allopex, let alone "Elf on a Seahorse" or "Aspect of Big Cloak as a Centrepiece".

To reiterate - my point was that while both factions need more kits, Fyreslayers are more short-changed in that regard than the Elves. Which is hardly a shock, given Elf Privilege when it comes to gaming.

I'll relist the breakdowns, to make this need a bit clearer. I'll leave Gotrek out entirely, as apparently both factions can taken him.

Fyreslayers
4 infantry clampack characters
"Endless Spells" (not spells, as Dwarfs, but you know what I mean)
Terrain piece
Underworlds warband (now available without Underworlds cards)
Infantry Kit A - Vulkite Berserkers - makes one unit, with weapon options
Infantry Kit B - Hearthguard Berserkers - also makes Auric Hearthguard
Monster Kit A - Magmadroth - Comes with options to make three different CHARACTER on Magmadroth units, and parts can make build two characters on foot as well (going by comments in this thread, and if the right mounted option is used?)

Idoneth
4 infantry clampack characters
Terrain piece
Underworlds warband (still available with Underworlds cards)
Infantry Kit A - Namarti Thralls - makes one unit, with some weapon options, though I don't know if that's just cosmetic
Infantry Kit B - Namarti Reavers - makes one unit, with some (cosmetic?) weapon options
Cavalry Kit A - Akhelian Ishlaen Guard - kit can alternatively build Morrsarr Guard (two units, one box)
Monster Kit A - Akhelian Allopex
Monster Kit B - Akhelian Leviadon
Monster Kit C - Eidolon - Makes two different Aspects
Monster Kit D - Akhelian King - Also includes a special character build

Both factions pick up one new clampack infantry character from the battle box, so that's a score draw.

This would seem to - thanks to the Magmadroth kit - leave the Fyreslayers up a couple of infantry character options, but they're behind everywhere else, especially in terms of number of different kits available.

You might play Idoneth, I don't know - but in terms of "need", it should be clear from the above who is in greater "need" of additional kits.

They do both need more kits before several other factions should get additional release slots, though.

 Dysartes wrote:

I'm amused that you think any of what you put there was actually working against my overall point, Kan - if anything, you've strengthened it. Also, the use of "Monster" was more of a colloquial one that a rules-based one - couldn't think of a better term for "two Elves and a trident launcher jump a shark" in the case of the Allopex, let alone "Elf on a Seahorse" or "Aspect of Big Cloak as a Centrepiece".

"Large-based cavalry", "cavalry hero", "weirdly overlarge elf".

To reiterate - my point was that while both factions need more kits, Fyreslayers are more short-changed in that regard than the Elves. Which is hardly a shock, given Elf Privilege when it comes to gaming.

Fyreslayers have had two books in the time Idoneth had one. Their first book, granted, was basically the book with almost the entire range released (exception being the scenery piece, Invocations, and the Doomseeker...who came out via Silver Tower), with the second book just bringing them "up to speed".

I'll relist the breakdowns, to make this need a bit clearer. I'll leave Gotrek out entirely, as apparently both factions can taken him.

Fyreslayers
4 infantry clampack characters

Launched with 3. Doomseeker was added after Silver Tower was discontinued.

"Endless Spells" (not spells, as Dwarfs, but you know what I mean)
Terrain piece

Came out with the book's second iteration, which also saw the baseline Fyreslayer models go up to 2W a pop.

Which is something that I really feel gets glossed over a lot.

Underworlds warband (now available without Underworlds cards)

Has been available since the end of Shadespire's season, where it was part of a bulk drop of every warband that came out then. They were a "season one" group. The webstore lists it as a release for 2018.

Infantry Kit A - Vulkite Berserkers - makes one unit, with weapon options

Makes one unit, with 3 different weapon options. Axe+shield, War-Pick+Shield, Twin Axes. The weapon options there are just as dramatically different in terms of effect as the Eels are, with the shields effectively making a whole different feel to the unit.

Infantry Kit B - Hearthguard Berserkers - also makes Auric Hearthguard

And Hearthguard Berzerkers have a weapon option.

Monster Kit A - Magmadroth - Comes with options to make three different CHARACTER on Magmadroth units, and parts can make build two characters on foot as well (going by comments in this thread, and if the right mounted option is used?)

Cool, so real-quick:
It has options to make three different non-named character on Magmadroth units. One of them(Runeson) has two different weapon options (Ancestral Axe and Wyrmslayer Javelins) while the other two (Runefather and Runesmiter) have no weapon options. The Runeson and Runefather both share the same set of riding/standing legs but have different torsos. The Runesmiter is a body with legs and arms attached, meaning he can be built on foot for either version of the riding guys--hence 3 characters if you build either a Runeson or a Runefather riding the Magmadroth while only two if building a Runesmiter riding the Magmadroth.

It's also worth mentioning that for some time, GW just wasn't trying to even hide the Start-Collecting set being the best deal for anyone playing Fyreslayers. It's a $95 set that gets you a Magmadroth and a box of Vulkite Berzerkers. The Magmadroth, when it first released, was $110.

Idoneth
4 infantry clampack characters

3.
Lotann, the named guy with the octopus, is a boxed set. Also named character that really is built to be taken with Namarti not Idoneth in general.

Each of the infantry clamshells is...situational, for lack of a better term. The Tidecaster is the only Enclave tied Wizard in the book and her "big deal" ability for being your general is letting you swap the Tides of Death to start at the end and work to the beginning. If doing so, Reavers became Battleline because she has the Isharann keyword and Eels couldn't(theirs was tied to having an Akhelian General). Soulscryer let you 'deepstrike' with 2 additional units, and also turned Reavers into Battleline cause Isharann keyword.
Soulrender's abilities were tied to Namarti. It let you return slain Namarti(D3) to the unit, adding 1 to the roll for each enemy model slain by the Soulrender that turn. Also...it was Isharann. And had a hangman's knot that was for fighting enemy non-monster heroes.

Terrain piece
Underworlds warband (still available with Underworlds cards)

Underworlds warband just came out last year. June 5, 2021 was the preorder date.

Infantry Kit A - Namarti Thralls - makes one unit, with some weapon options, though I don't know if that's just cosmetic
Infantry Kit B - Namarti Reavers - makes one unit, with some (cosmetic?) weapon options

All cosmetic.

Cavalry Kit A - Akhelian Ishlaen Guard - kit can alternatively build Morrsarr Guard (two units, one box)

So, see the comment I made earlier about the Vulkites? That's what happened here. The Morrsarr Guard have two special rules tied to their spears. The Ishlaen Guard have one rule that is tied to their shields instead.

Monster Kit A - Akhelian Allopex

Has two weapon options, a harpoon and a net.

Monster Kit B - Akhelian Leviadon
Monster Kit C - Eidolon - Makes two different Aspects

Also it's a hero. That didn't get Enclave benefits. But did have a murder aura on the Aspect of the Storm and was a Wizard on Aspect of the Sea(which was helpful, since it let you sidestep the locked wizard spells for Enclaves).

Monster Kit D - Akhelian King - Also includes a special character build

Yeah...and basically you never saw anything but the special character, since he was the Akhelian King with an additional two units affected by his command ability.

Plus see above regarding Eels.

Both factions pick up one new clampack infantry character from the battle box, so that's a score draw.

Context does matter though. Fyreslayers are a faction where their Start Collecting kit was arguably a phenomenal buy-in spot for the faction, being 2-3 heroes, a monster mount for one of those heroes, and a battleline unit that was widely decried as "too expensive" to buy otherwise.
Their new hero from the upcoming battlebox? Also seems to, again, be a flexible hero...while the Idoneth one is seeming to just be a Soulrender with a keyword swap. I hope to be proven wrong though, as I really like that model!

This would seem to - thanks to the Magmadroth kit - leave the Fyreslayers up a couple of infantry character options, but they're behind everywhere else, especially in terms of number of different kits available.

When their kits actually build different weapon options, is that really a big deal though? I don't think so.

You might play Idoneth, I don't know - but in terms of "need", it should be clear from the above who is in greater "need" of additional kits.

I do play Idoneth. I also know that the faction basically is keyword soup...Fyreslayers aren't.