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Problem is that they are if gw stick to what they said originally about all old armies being playable immediately. Can't do that if they screw with the base sizes.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Problem is that they are if gw stick to what they said originally about all old armies being playable immediately. Can't do that if they screw with the base sizes.

Depends on if they standardise what size bases models have - a la AoS - or say use whatever you want, like 40k.

Well it will be standardized because it's ranked. Also that doesn't address the problem if they suddenly decide to adjust base sizes and screw over anybody who had an old army and now can't play because they have to rebase their old models.

I assume they’ll make trays that hold round bases.

 Inquisitor Gideon wrote:
Problem is that they are if gw stick to what they said originally about all old armies being playable immediately. Can't do that if they screw with the base sizes.

They are happy to sell you new bases.

They didn't say your 2k list gets to play as it is. Points etc change. Rebasing is norm for GW.

And they can of course go for use what you had like elsewhere. New models with new base sizes, old with old.

Did they ever say you don't have to rebase models? That doesnt' invalidate your old armies. Just make bit extra work. Or they go with your models are usable with this legends army list with your old base. Then here's new models used in this army list with different base size. They didn't say anything about mixing old and new models either.

 Overread wrote:
Honestly almost everything in AoS would fit into Old World.


Death Grand Alliance is basically just the Vampire army split into 3 parts.

Destruction is almost entirely Old World models with a few updates here and there

Chaos is the same, updates and mostly Old World stuff

The brand new armies that are totally new like fish elves would have easily fit into Old World since the sea would have given them room to grow as a force, change the lore around of course.


The Sylvaneth are just an offshoot of the Wood Elves without the Elves; etc..


Basically almost all the models would fit in the Old World setting. Ironically the Stormcast would likely be the ones with the biggest lore shift to justify in the setting. Otherwise pretty much every other faction fits.

For me, it's more about the aesthetic and the tone over what could feasibly appear in The Old World. Fyreslayers are, broadly, just slayers with some extra monsters but the models themselves would look bizarre in an Old World setting with all the bling thrown on them. Lumineth are far too many design steps away from High Elves to transfer over comfortably (if at all). Ossiarchs would struggle to transfer over at all; there's nothing 'Khemri' about them. Stormcast are obvious 'No-Nos'. Chaos, Lizardmen, Skaven, most Greenskins; grand. They've retained a lot of their identity from previous incarnations. Kharadon... eh. Even if the technology theoretically existed (or its equivalent) in The Old World, the whole steampunk look is a massive aesthetic shift.

I think it's a stretch to say that every faction fits. Some do. Others are too far gone into AoS design to port backwards without a dramatic re-evaluation of what Warhammer Fantasy looks like. Which isn't me negging on AoS designs; just acknowledging that they're sometimes very different in tone (and other times, they're not).

The increase in "bling" is less of a design change and more of a materials change. Don't forget old world hero models in metal had plenty of over the top bling and design on them. The plastics were simpler because it was party a function of the material and GW's skill at working with it.
Lumineth would have just been the next upgrade for the High Elves. Or perhaps they'd be a coven of elves from the far eastern regions when GW opened up to releasing Nippon and Cathay onto the table as part of expanding the game. So you'd have the traditional haughty High Elves and then their more Eastern/Australian cousins come to join the fight.

As for Ossiarchs they'd easily fit too.

Just have Nagash arise again and then have the Tomb Kings throw off the shackles of his control over them. An enraged Nagash cursing them and with the Vampires always fickle and likely eager to learn the secret from the Tomb Kings, Nagash might well throw his great powers into crafting the Ossiarchs in the Old World.

Remember Ossiarchs aren't "replacing" Tomb Kings, they are a different take on the concept of skeleton/bone warriors.

 Overread wrote:
The increase in "bling" is less of a design change and more of a materials change. Don't forget old world hero models in metal had plenty of over the top bling and design on them. The plastics were simpler because it was party a function of the material and GW's skill at working with it.
Lumineth would have just been the next upgrade for the High Elves. Or perhaps they'd be a coven of elves from the far eastern regions when GW opened up to releasing Nippon and Cathay onto the table as part of expanding the game. So you'd have the traditional haughty High Elves and then their more Eastern/Australian cousins come to join the fight.

As for Ossiarchs they'd easily fit too.

Just have Nagash arise again and then have the Tomb Kings throw off the shackles of his control over them. An enraged Nagash cursing them and with the Vampires always fickle and likely eager to learn the secret from the Tomb Kings, Nagash might well throw his great powers into crafting the Ossiarchs in the Old World.

Remember Ossiarchs aren't "replacing" Tomb Kings, they are a different take on the concept of skeleton/bone warriors.

What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Oh I agree, I meant that AoS would work in Old World in terms of if they'd advanced past the End Times with the ET failing to happen etc...

That said I fully expect to see AoS models as counts-as or whatever in Old World. Functionallty we'll have to see how they handle it and my biggest worry is that one game will eclipse the other in sales. That said GW has done well balancing 40K and 30K and 30K only leans on Marine design ethos so a really limited creative pool visually - though marines are a bit of an enigma in how well they sell .

I don't think we'll see anything official but we will see a lot of people trying to cram 40mm models onto 25mm square bases. Other than that it's a side game so if you thought GW treated WFB poorly before...

 Overread wrote:
The increase in "bling" is less of a design change and more of a materials change. Don't forget old world hero models in metal had plenty of over the top bling and design on them. The plastics were simpler because it was party a function of the material and GW's skill at working with it.
Lumineth would have just been the next upgrade for the High Elves. Or perhaps they'd be a coven of elves from the far eastern regions when GW opened up to releasing Nippon and Cathay onto the table as part of expanding the game. So you'd have the traditional haughty High Elves and then their more Eastern/Australian cousins come to join the fight.

As for Ossiarchs they'd easily fit too.

Just have Nagash arise again and then have the Tomb Kings throw off the shackles of his control over them. An enraged Nagash cursing them and with the Vampires always fickle and likely eager to learn the secret from the Tomb Kings, Nagash might well throw his great powers into crafting the Ossiarchs in the Old World.

Remember Ossiarchs aren't "replacing" Tomb Kings, they are a different take on the concept of skeleton/bone warriors.

I still can't agree with this sentiment; my point on the 'bling' was more to illustrate that there's not that much difference between Slayers and Fyreslayers in terms of the core design, but the latter would still look out of place (material change is naff-all to do with it on that one; those Fyreslayer plastics are, themselves, very basic). It wasn't necessarily a commentary on the general level of 'bling' between WHFB and AoS.

Ossiarchs, to me, just don't look like a faction that would pop up in the Old World, irrespective of any lore shifts (which, I appreciate is somewhat contrary given the very clear design cues they took from the End Times undead releases). Ditto for Lumineth. The lore certainly bends to service any potential changes; it's fantasy, you can adapt it to justify whatever you want, but that doesn't mean that those changes necessarily fit the tone of the setting.

It's fairly redundant anyway as they're, pretty clearly, not incorporating any of the AoS-specific factions into The Old World when it appears based on what we've seen so far.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tsagualsa wrote:


What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

JimmyWolf87 wrote:


Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

Well, that one community article where they reminded the reader several times that the End Times totally did happen, the Old World, sorry, World That Was, is very much dead and gone and that's a fact, comes to mind, but then who gives a crap what GW 'allows' anyway - their 'official' turn of events and stories is just one of many, sensible players have always mixed and matched official and homebrew stuff, as well as the results of their own campaigns or roleplaying stories.

I just think players should not set themselves up for dissappointment by expecting too much from this 'The Old World' project - we still don't know much else besides their confirmations of having square bases, the possibility to use old models and the general setting. Until we know more it'd be foolish the speculate on cross-setting compatibility and new armies.

Tsagualsa wrote:

JimmyWolf87 wrote:


Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

Well, that one community article where they reminded the reader several times that the End Times totally did happen, the Old World, sorry, World That Was, is very much dead and gone and that's a fact, comes to mind, but then who gives a crap what GW 'allows' anyway - their 'official' turn of events and stories is just one of many, sensible players have always mixed and matched official and homebrew stuff, as well as the results of their own campaigns or roleplaying stories.

I just think players should not set themselves up for dissappointment by expecting too much from this 'The Old World' project - we still don't know much else besides their confirmations of having square bases, the possibility to use old models and the general setting. Until we know more it'd be foolish the speculate on cross-setting compatibility and new armies.

Sure, that was egregious and annoying but there's a gulf of context between that and the idea that they've been suggesting players can't create their own narratives (of whatever scale).

Tsagualsa wrote:

What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Ofcourse, the whole Old World project is based on nostalgia and predictability (in the setting) as opposed to AoS "anything goes" pilosophy where every new faction can invent brand new lore and worlds to justify a cool design they just came up with.
I think there is room for both styles -either you make up lore around the models you build, like in AoS, or you build models around the lore, like The Old World (or Horus Heresy, for that matter). I think both styles can be equally satisfying if you have the possibility to play multiple armies/game systems.

 Fayric wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:

What you say is true, but sadly it's not the way GW have chosen. They're deliberately going back in time in the Old World, so stuff like Cathay arriving on the scene, Nagash reawakening and so on can't happen, or at least can't happen until the next timeshift or retcon. The big story beats are set in stone by word of the authors, you're only 'allowed' small, human scale stories and events against a backdrop of 'this is what happens at the large scale'. Of course, all of that is bunk and you can do whatever you want, and some sort of fan edition will probably appear, but that's how GW intends it to go down.

Ofcourse, the whole Old World project is based on nostalgia and predictability (in the setting) as opposed to AoS "anything goes" pilosophy where every new faction can invent brand new lore and worlds to justify a cool design they just came up with.
I think there is room for both styles -either you make up lore around the models you build, like in AoS, or you build models around the lore, like The Old World (or Horus Heresy, for that matter). I think both styles can be equally satisfying if you have the possibility to play multiple armies/game systems.

I'm personally happy with the Old World as a backdrop mainly for RPGs and skirmish gaming / Oldhammer, so the direction they're going in suits me just fine.

JSG wrote:
I don't think we'll see anything official but we will see a lot of people trying to cram 40mm models onto 25mm square bases. Other than that it's a side game so if you thought GW treated WFB poorly before...

We already have seen. Not pretty.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Tsagualsa wrote:

JimmyWolf87 wrote:


Cathay (and Kislev) are nigh on confirmed as coming. Very much a personal take but I'm actually glad the emphasis looks to be more on the smaller scale stuff (though I think it's more than a little disingenuous to suggest that there's been any sort of comment from the developers on what's 'allowed'; where does that notion even come from?). I've seen what happens when GW attempt world-encompassing narrative shifts in the Warhammer World. A few times.

Well, that one community article where they reminded the reader several times that the End Times totally did happen, the Old World, sorry, World That Was, is very much dead and gone and that's a fact, comes to mind, but then who gives a crap what GW 'allows' anyway - their 'official' turn of events and stories is just one of many, sensible players have always mixed and matched official and homebrew stuff, as well as the results of their own campaigns or roleplaying stories.

I just think players should not set themselves up for dissappointment by expecting too much from this 'The Old World' project - we still don't know much else besides their confirmations of having square bases, the possibility to use old models and the general setting. Until we know more it'd be foolish the speculate on cross-setting compatibility and new armies.

Sure. And that just means game will have room for thousands of years poorly explored area.

The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

Goose LeChance wrote:
everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I'm not sure what GW/forgeworld prices for that stuff are going to be, but i'm confident that it won't be pretty.

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I wonder, if TOW turns out to be a lemon, will ex-WFB players who've been hanging on finally acknowledge the existence of other, minis-agnostic rank 'n' flank games...?

Naaah, easier to just give up altogether if daddy GW isn't the one to give up the bling.

Anyway, agreed with the wait and see approach. TOW may or may not be all our favourite parts of WFB, back from the dead and ready to whisk us away on a comet, but even if it has a veneer of familiarity, I think it's likely to be something new and unexpected.

 Vermis wrote:

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I wonder, if TOW turns out to be a lemon, will ex-WFB players who've been hanging on finally acknowledge the existence of other, minis-agnostic rank 'n' flank games...?

Naaah, easier to just give up altogether if daddy GW isn't the one to give up the bling.

Anyway, agreed with the wait and see approach. TOW may or may not be all our favourite parts of WFB, back from the dead and ready to whisk us away on a comet, but even if it has a veneer of familiarity, I think it's likely to be something new and unexpected.

I have Oathmark and Asoiaf (even though I hate GoT) because I like the models and games. But I can't really blame people for wanting GW models when the alternatives are Mantic or 3d printers.

Rules are just paper, they can go back to old editions, try 9th or whatever. Some game systems are too different and don't capture the feel of WHFB if that's what they're after.

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Even if the rules suck, which is highly likely because it's GW we're talking about, everyone can just go back to playing older editions as long as they put the old model ranges back into production and maybe release some new ones. Ebay prices are joke for some of this stuff.

I've just started looking at 6th edition WHFB with some friends, and yeah you're not kidding. Ridiculous prices. The old Empire battalion (not army, the battalion) is going for like $400+. Mounted wizard is $75, it's worse than regular GW prices lol

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Then maybe people interested in TOW can take the TOW discussion back to the TOW thread, rather than cluttering up the AoS thread?

Voss wrote:

Goose LeChance wrote:
The entire appeal of TOW is that it isn't AOS

Then maybe people interested in TOW can take the TOW discussion back to the TOW thread, rather than cluttering up the AoS thread?

Yeah probably but I didn't start it

JSG wrote:
I don't think we'll see anything official but we will see a lot of people trying to cram 40mm models onto 25mm square bases. Other than that it's a side game so if you thought GW treated WFB poorly before...

i feel like this is an attack at me and the new saurus ... id be interested in the Old World if it has army building rules like before. lots of items and options to choose, large groups of models, using the big monsters (including maybe new ones that got added since Age of Sigmar) but the new saurus, as an example, look so much better.

SF

Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

That looks familiar *badum-tish*

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

I don't know exactly what it is, but I love it!
New Herald or just something fun?

 KidCthulhu wrote:

Dudeface wrote:
Dropped this on the 40k rumour thread too, no idea what system it might be for:

Spoiler:

I don't know exactly what it is, but I love it!
New Herald or just something fun?

I think it's something like a Sorceror's familiar, it looks to weedy to be a proper demon.

Unlikely to be aos release though could get rules. Kt etc would be more likely.

Or it's just art/kitbash and not preview

tneva82 wrote:
Unlikely to be aos release though could get rules. Kt etc would be more likely.

Or it's just art/kitbash and not preview

It can also always be some random event/anniversary/warhammer+ miniature without any relation to any larger release.