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There are some interesting variations on charges and range from other game systems.

One extreme example has all charges making it, regardless of distance. But the effectiveness of the troops diminish the longer the charge has to go.

You can declare a charge right away from across the entire table, and your poor exhausted troops will hit the enemy like a puff of cotton candy and melt away.

Another variation has a limit to range that can be pre-measured, and then dice are rolled to see at what distance the troops start to diminish. Similar to the first version but the charge distance is limited and the troops being spent is random.

3rd edition Warhammer had a series of conditions that would result in a loss of charge bonus. Other situations resulted in a loss of charge bonus and the charging unit being unformed- which could result in it auto breaking if it lost combat.

2 rules from 3rd edition that would make a new version interesting are the unformed rules, and no unit taking a break test until it had lost 25% of its starting strength. I really think the latter solves a lot of problems that later versions suffered from.

Back to the topic now please.

Okay, so we know Bret foot knights are coming out in plastic (they showed us renders of the weapon arms) and we're pretty sure the old men at arms are getting re-released.

Does this mean the new food knights will be in scale with older models instead of being the giant humans in AOS? That alone is exciting news for me

I would hope so but the new foot paladin looked embiggened to me.

The one thing that gives me hope about the Paladin's scale is that the impaled Orc head on his base still looks huge in comparison.

EDIT: big image of Paladin (plus the helmet-less version) and the new Tomb King side-by side

 KidCthulhu wrote:

Does this mean the new food knights will be in scale with older models instead of being the giant humans in AOS? That alone is exciting news for me

Kinda sorta seems that way. And if so, it puts me off any chance of buying anything, personally. I really like the proportions and size of the modern stuff, and was really hoping they would make anything new in that style.

Just bringing back old models and making new ones to fit those proportions makes this a no go for me.

I dunno, how do you justify the significant height difference with the Tomb King? Thats like a 1ft difference in stature between them - the tomb kings lower jaw is sitting at the Paladins eye level.

Nehekarans were enormous people, if I remember the lore correctly.

chaos0xomega wrote:
I dunno, how do you justify the significant height difference with the Tomb King? Thats like a 1ft difference in stature between them - the tomb kings lower jaw is sitting at the Paladins eye level.

Tomb Kings got embiggened in the 8th ed model wave. New The Old World models would use that as a standard rather than going back to the smaller models from 6th ed, some of which got discontinued and replaced by those 8th ed updates.

Bretonnians didn't have that happen to them for lack of any new models in 7th and 8th ed.

If the new models are sculpted to match existing miniature lines, that's how it's bound to go. Which indeed has ample potential to suck for people who are happy with GW's modern proportions. It's not exactly ideal for anybody else either. If The Old World is a success that GW intends to keep supporting, you end up with non-future proofed models much the same as Horus Heresy between 1st ed and 2nd ed. GW is redoing Mk.III Marines in fall apparently because of the stunted old ones no longer fitting GW's new Marines. You're still expected to get your Mk.IV fix in old and ugly. You still have the same for characters and special units. The Old World might end up all over the place in terms of model size if at some point the designers are sick of that nonsense and want modern proportions but GW is unwilling to invest enough money in full range refreshes for a side game that isn't even based on their big earner.

 Rihgu wrote:
Nehekarans were enormous people, if I remember the lore correctly.

I remember that lore. At the time I was wondering if the BL authors had some weird axe to grind, and only later found out the minis were just out of scale.

the lore that they were large because of a blessing of the gods that was lost and later humans therefore smaller (and with a shorter live) came later after the minis were out

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Rihgu wrote:
Nehekarans were enormous people, if I remember the lore correctly.

I remember that lore. At the time I was wondering if the BL authors had some weird axe to grind, and only later found out the minis were just out of scale.

Wasn't that incorporated into the lore because of the basic Skeleton minis?
They were massive but created around what? 6th ed or earlier?

The TK upgrades were based on them, & they were not updated before the End Times.
New Tomb Kings units/models used the Skeletons as their scale reference.

When Vampire Counts got their own Skeletons that had clothes/armor, they were scaled down to look like they could fit inside a living body, as well as the magic wind from behind look.

So we got the in-universe explanation that the people of Khemri were giants.

 skrulnik wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 Rihgu wrote:
Nehekarans were enormous people, if I remember the lore correctly.

I remember that lore. At the time I was wondering if the BL authors had some weird axe to grind, and only later found out the minis were just out of scale.

Wasn't that incorporated into the lore because of the basic Skeleton minis?
They were massive but created around what? 6th ed or earlier?

The TK upgrades were based on them, & they were not updated before the End Times.
New Tomb Kings units/models used the Skeletons as their scale reference.

When Vampire Counts got their own Skeletons that had clothes/armor, they were scaled down to look like they could fit inside a living body, as well as the magic wind from behind look.

So we got the in-universe explanation that the people of Khemri were giants.

It's also a semi-common trope with Ancient Aliens / Biblical Literalist peoples and related pseudoscientific fields, basically they take e.g. biblical descriptions literal in that people running around at that time were 9 foot tall and lived for 800 years or whatever I always took it as at least partially being a tongue-in-cheek allusion towards that as well.

Hey before we start complaining about their height difference, let's wait untill both are actually released and a proper scale comparison is actually made. We don't even know what base size these things are on.

Most of the scale differences between old skeletons and the newer ones is due to a stylistic decision to abandon the "Heroic" features such as large hands, feet, and head in favor of more normal proportions. You see it in the old vs new chaos cultist models, too.

 KidCthulhu wrote:

Does this mean the new food knights will be in scale with older models instead of being the giant humans in AOS?

They will be in scale with bretonnian last plastic kits for sure, since they already stated that those are coming back.

Deleted, WAY off topic.

Did I dream that there was a WHC statement of "an article for TOW on June"? Did I miss it? I am confused...

 Darnok wrote:
Did I dream that there was a WHC statement of "an article for TOW on June"? Did I miss it? I am confused...

Not a dream.

From the May 23 dev diary, very last line of the article:

Thanks very much guys – that’s a ton of useful information. Warhammer: The Old World is marching closer to release, and there’ll be another development diary coming at some time in June.

 nels1031 wrote:

 Darnok wrote:
Did I dream that there was a WHC statement of "an article for TOW on June"? Did I miss it? I am confused...

Not a dream.

From the May 23 dev diary, very last line of the article:

Thanks very much guys – that’s a ton of useful information. Warhammer: The Old World is marching closer to release, and there’ll be another development diary coming at some time in June.

At least we'll get one whole model shown tomorrow...

Yes, but tomorrow isn't June anymore. Therefore we got shortchanged. Therefore we now have to burn Nottingham to the ground. It's the only way this can go.

Makes me wonder if the author simply mixed up June and July and June was meant to be out to begin with because of how big a deal 10th ed 40k marketing was going to be this month.

they did not wrote which year, so there is still a chance for June 2024, close to the release.....

 Geifer wrote:
Yes, but tomorrow isn't June anymore. Therefore we got shortchanged. Therefore we now have to burn Nottingham to the ground. It's the only way this can go.

Makes me wonder if the author simply mixed up June and July and June was meant to be out to begin with because of how big a deal 10th ed 40k marketing was going to be this month.

Honestly, their 'diaries' are exercises in non-commital vagueness anyway, if you can clean one or two clear sentences out of one you had a good month... they're just too thin on actual information for me to get excited over missing one

Watch them drop a bomb on us tomorrow and announce an idea on when this is projected to launch. I know it’s extremely unlikely but one can hope lol.

 nathan2004 wrote:
Watch them drop a bomb on us tomorrow and announce an idea on when this is projected to launch. I know it’s extremely unlikely but one can hope lol.

Pulls a Nintendo.

"The Pre-order period for Warhammer: the Old World begins, after this presentation"

 ProfSrlojohn wrote:

 nathan2004 wrote:
Watch them drop a bomb on us tomorrow and announce an idea on when this is projected to launch. I know it’s extremely unlikely but one can hope lol.

Pulls a Nintendo.

"The Pre-order period for Warhammer: the Old World begins, after this presentation"

Maybe it will be the same gakshow as 10th ed

That was definitely a reveal.

Alright you know what to do- Kopium Krew explain how this isn't a dumpster fire with no plan! Go!

caladancid wrote:
That was definitely a reveal.

Alright you know what to do- Kopium Krew explain how this isn't a dumpster fire with no plan! Go!

There's nothing about this new miniature specifically that supports the idea any more or less than previous things do.

caladancid wrote:
That was definitely a reveal.

Alright you know what to do- Kopium Krew explain how this isn't a dumpster fire with no plan! Go!

It feels like you'd do TOW a favour by just turning off the machines at this point. I'm not sure if they even intend to release this game like, ever, they'll just 'preview' it at a rate of one model per quarter until eternity, or until the last die-hard fans have worked through the phases of grief and accepted that literally nothing is still better than this.

Their language in the presentation (... 'we have much more to show once we approach that particular release'... and such) has made it clear that it's still far, far off, and at this point entire game systems have been designed and released while TOW still languishes.

Why does it look like he's missing half his torso?