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2013/11/17 15:52:47
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
Eleven more days? This kickstarter won't last eleven more hours, man!
All joking aside, I do hope it collects a few more backers soon. It'd be nice to get past that, er, not so great stretch goal and on to the Crusher (which has a much, much better explanation than its creators ever gave, but that's besides the point... )
2013/11/17 16:01:37
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
Prodos is significantly smaller than Mantic (there were 3 of them at the start of the Warzone KS)
Resin itself is not too expensive,
the moulds however are (compared to metal) as they wear out really fast, that is one of the big costs, the other is staff as it's far slower to cast in than metal
2013/11/17 16:20:28
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
I'm not saying the mid project maliase isnt present.
Lets look at that post that keeps getting taken of context.
Hellfury wrote: And to be honest, this does reflect poorly on Prodos. The transparency level for investing/preordering or whatever yu choose to think of KS is petty damn low for most. So now we are left with a stalling project who lacks momentum for very explicable reasons. And in this socialist exercise, we see the benefit of everyone faltering because of a lack of planning/foresight by the creators. This is not just mid project malais as Mark remarked on in the comments section.
Small company or not, personal issues like a baby being born or not, the lack of Prodos participation is enhancing the effect of the 'mid project malaise'. Reasons for their lack of participation/info sharing may well be valid, but that does not take away the effect of that lack.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
2013/11/17 17:42:58
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
RiTides wrote: They have sculpts for the Warriors and Praetorian, just are awaiting approval to show them. This is a good thing- the first glimpse of the PredAlien was horrid, the latest sculpt is absolutely ace!
Also he took a quick screenshot in the comments to show that he's still editing the video, they were removing some unapproved parts apparently, before they post it later today:
And this comment makes me VERY happy:
Prodos wrote:@Prodos
Could you come up with ideas or pledges for those of us looking at the wargame aspect?
@william, hmm there is one "looking good there,boss!", we will add 2 more after the Wargame book is "unlocked".
Since I'm here for the wargaming part, a pledge with just the hardback book and add-ons, no board game, would be most welcome! At 125 pounds or a hair higher so that it benefits from that stretch goal would be best
Has anyone asked Prodos about doing a miniatures + rulebook pledge level? I would but haven't pledged yet.
2013/11/17 18:02:20
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
Looks like my concerns about folks hoping for a gridded board game not getting it may be valid.
Again, that won't hurt this KS too much, but likely will affect the retail version.
The presence of an 'anti-vehicle' stat bodes well for folks wanting the APC, but it also is an indicator the 'wargame' is the driver, not the board game. That wouldn't be an issue except again, the retail version looks to be marketed as a board game. I get the impression the board game is kind of an after thought even though the game is packaged as one. I suspect there was a big desire to reuse Warzone rules/mechanisms instead of develop a set of board game rules.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/17 20:38:51
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
2013/11/17 20:38:15
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
I'm so glad I waited for this. If you see the pledge total go down by around £300, its because I only need to keep enough in to get colonial marine models.
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 2 minutes ago
Movement is" for Wargame (open terrain play) and grids for board game.
so model with a Movement 5 will travel 5" in wargame OR 5 grids in board game
2013/11/17 20:44:36
Subject: Re:Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
That wasn't the best video, it felt, well kind of awkward. The rules don't feel really interesting. This just keeps feeling very "meh" overall. I really do believe they should have had a game play video from the start, as well as more pictures of the models and not just renders. Overall a lack of readiness is what seems to be causing these problems, but it doesn't look like it's going to improve any time soon.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/11/17 20:48:28
Little orphans in the snow
With nowhere to call a home
Start their singing, singing
Waiting through the summertime
To thaw your hearts in wintertime
That's why they're singing, singing
2013/11/17 20:46:52
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
xowainx wrote: Creator Prodos Games Ltd 2 minutes ago Movement is" for Wargame (open terrain play) and grids for board game. so model with a Movement 5 will travel 5" in wargame OR 5 grids in board game
The resin terrain has no grids, the low res pictures I see of the tiles don't clearly show a grid, and they knew that was an issue and said the video would resolve it )and the video clearly does not solve it). When directly asked how big the squares or hexes were no real answer was ever given. Folks are going to watch the video, see the inches as measurement, not bother going through the thousands of comments to find a different answer.
Prodos is really screwing the pooch on how they are communicating. Put it in the FAQ. Put it in a clear concise update.
It really is not that hard to do.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/17 20:47:46
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
2013/11/17 20:55:12
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
That video did nothing to help convince people and 1 minute 30 of 5 minutes was just reselling is stuff we already know. This project has gone from a must have to top of my list of KS to drop if funds run low and with Heroquest starting on Friday there's a very real chance of that happening. I get that their hands are being tied by Fox with what they can say or show but they should be doing more with what they have.
I also don't think the boardgame has a grid based movement and they are trying to side step the issue - that said the tiles in the video look like paper prototypes so that can be changed before release.
Edit: The KS has lost about £1,400 since the video hmmm they probably should have waited and put the full thing up.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/11/17 21:01:55
2013/11/17 21:00:38
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
Meep. Sucks to see this one kind of struggling, I had expected such an IP to do much better. I realize there's a week and a half left, but I thought this was supposed to be the killer project of doom to end other projects. I think they might have done better by glossing over on the stat cards and actually showing people play instead of outright explaining it (and briefly). The MA gameplay video wasn't exactly stunning, but at least you got an idea of how a really basic scenario would go. Maybe part 2 of the video will help things along?
2013/11/17 21:03:23
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
GrimDork wrote: Meep. Sucks to see this one kind of struggling, I had expected such an IP to do much better. I realize there's a week and a half left, but I thought this was supposed to be the killer project of doom to end other projects. I think they might have done better by glossing over on the stat cards and actually showing people play instead of outright explaining it (and briefly). The MA gameplay video wasn't exactly stunning, but at least you got an idea of how a really basic scenario would go. Maybe part 2 of the video will help things along?
This is what happens when the power of a franchise blinds people to reason, and unlike Mars Attacks, I just can't see this bouncing back. Mars Attacks had numerous updates, really good deals, and had some awesome models. It was obvious that Mantic was pretty ready for what they were about to launch, and tried to keep up contact with the fanbase. I know it had some trouble (and by some big trouble) near the end, but it bounced back really well.
Oh and we've dropped from £185,00 to £183,944 at an alarming rate.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/11/17 21:07:31
Little orphans in the snow
With nowhere to call a home
Start their singing, singing
Waiting through the summertime
To thaw your hearts in wintertime
That's why they're singing, singing
2013/11/17 21:12:15
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
I'm thinking of waiting for the retail version, and maybe augmenting it with a few of the resin figures available at that point. I'm in no hurry so waiting doesn't hurt me. My painting time and skill level are such that the plastics will work well for me (and be more durable with my daughter playing and for possible convention use).
I want to like this, but I also want it for the game, not just the resin figures. I fully get that for the resin figure crowd in love with the IP this is a decent deal.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
2013/11/17 21:45:00
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
Prodos are answering questions on the comments board - said they are going to repost the vid so that it's high res.
Backers has levelled at 1200 but the pledge level has dropped back to ~£183k, so looks like a lot of folk have reduced their pledge levels... Need some good PR and updates from Prodos to get those wavering back in the game...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/17 21:45:13
CptJake wrote: I'm thinking of waiting for the retail version
Gotta say, this has also been on my mind since watching the vid.
If you're more interested in the basic board game, and not the resin miniatures, this is probably the best path to take.
But as Jake says, for those who want resin minis this campaign makes sense. People have long been wishing for sweet models from this franchise, and on that part Prodos seems to be able to deliver (given their Warzone results thus far, although those are still coming in). The board game is more of an unknown, so I can understand folks who were interested in it only for that aspect, and not the models, wanting to wait.
I also wonder if they could have done better just marketing it as a wargame using the Warzone rules and sweet resin models. They're trying to strike a balance for both crowds, and that's a hard balance to make. But I'm in the wargaming crowd, and will be upping to a wargaming pledge with hardback rulebook most likely if they add one, so the board game issues don't really affect me personally (although I understand they affect a lot of others, particularly with how this was initially marketed).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/17 22:02:18
2013/11/17 22:01:41
Subject: Re:Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
I compiled a spreadsheet of the different pledges and made a price comparison based on figures only (inc shipping).
You can view it here : AVP pledge comparison It's nothing fancy, you are welcome to copy it and play with the numbers.
The best value so far is "If it bleeds we can kill it" at £210 (+£10 p&p) with a value of £392 that comes to a 44% discount
Next best is the base pledge really at £75 (+£10) with a value of £145 which comes to 41% discount.
The lowest discount is on the "Looking good there boss" at 31% discount, followed by "Get to the Chopper" at 33% discount.
As it stands - "Real Aliens" (£155) comes out cheaper (38%) than getting a base pledge (£75) + addon pledge (£100) inspite of the
freebies(35-36% depending on wether you are using 1 or 2 accounts). I guess this is more for those that want KS exclusive Berserkers.
It's still early days of course, and I reserve my rights to make a mistake... This includes the 2000 backers stretch and the 185k stretch.
Feel free to comment or suggest fancification. Most likely I'll just update this as stretchgoals are added.
Obviously the discount doesn't do much if you are not really into what's in the base box. I just thought it might be handy.
2013/11/17 22:02:12
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
but as to whether the gameplay will work well for a boardgame ?
(it certainly seems complicated, and from the way people expoited/got confused by/argued about the slightest issue in Sedition Wars this does not fill me with confidence)
but plenty of time for video 2 to convince me otherwise
2013/11/17 22:03:20
Subject: Alien vs Predator Miniatures Game from Prodos Games
For those not wanting to trawl through the comments... Spoilered as there's quite a lot....
Spoiler:
Alex Colbert 11 minutes ago
Prodos - Sidestepping the elephant in the room for a minute, are we still on track for army construction guidelines and/or points values tomorrow night?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 10 minutes ago
Alex yes thats the intent. As we said the vid needed a redo last minute and we wanted to meet our timing promises. We will take the feedback on the second part and get more on gameplay
Michael 11 minutes ago
@Prodos: How is movement handled in the boardgame? How is force construction organized? What types of troops are there to choose from? How much accounting is needed ( lots of tracking and marking on the cards)? Some of these have been answered by the video.
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 7 minutes ago
Michael: It uses a grid as was shown in the vid and will be futher focussed on in part 2
2. In the board game: Normal rules, sides are defined. Advanced rules models are pointed and a players choose to that point level while recognising the organisation chart.
3. Not much, wounds and a few other bits.
Jake Rose 9 minutes ago
"Will happily answer questions...."
How big are the square which make up the grid on the tiles?
How do the rules handle figures with bases bigger than those squares?
How is LOS handled in the board game? How does the grid affect that?
How is diagonal movement accounted for?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 5 minutes ago
Jake: How big are the square which make up the grid on the tiles? 1 inch
How do the rules handle figures with bases bigger than those squares? take 4 squares
How is LOS handled in the board game? How does the grid affect that? True
How is diagonal movement accounted for? Can move diagonally
Antenocitis Workshop Ltd 6 minutes ago
@Prodos: are the clear-cast Predator figures going to be unique poses, or will they be existing figures just clear-cast?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 5 minutes ago
Antenocitis: Initially same poses
Chris Baginski 19 minutes ago
@Prodos
I think I understand now why the boardgame has 'limited poseability' - the stat card for the predator clearly shows a shoulder cannon and wrist blades... meaning that for the boardgame that particular Hunter Predator needs to be geared like that.
Will there be a provision to change-up the gear for different weapon/equipment choices? Perhaps blank stat cards?
Also, Resin Terrain - when will we be able to see photos of the actual terrain with models shown in it/along side it? Renders are nice, but I would like to see the real thing... personally, I would be happy seeing actual shots of unpainted terrain.
Answering me in a PM, you suggested that 2 sets of Resin Terrain would be enough for the boardgame aspect - would you gentlemen consider offering a bundle of 2 sets of terrain for £250? That would conveniently make a pledge level of 'Get to the Chopper' the defacto pledge for the full boardgame experience if someone chose said terrain bundle. Lastly, regarding the Resin Terrain - if the boardgame deals with grid movement, how is the grid demarcated on the Resin Terrain?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 17 minutes ago
Chris: Basic game will be 'plug and play'. For the advanced yes.
Anastasios Lianos 18 minutes ago
@Prodos: If Kickstarter is downgrading your video quality, could you please upload the video to Youtube?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 17 minutes ago
Anastasios: we are
Arkangel 17 minutes ago
@ Prodos
Still waiting to hear about next weekend?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 16 minutes ago
Arkangel: Jarek will email all tomorrow
J S Morgan (Alien) 14 minutes ago
@Prodos Are the game tiles all going to be the same like the video could you not give the different themes and colour schemes related to locations from the films?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 12 minutes ago
JS: We are prepping the pictures now. They are based on a space ship and show normal, infected (by Alien) and specific rooms (refrectory etc).
Michael 13 minutes ago
Thanks for the answers, Prodos. I appreciate the work you put into this.
For the protocol: I have not lowered my pledge. And probably will not. And i'm still looking forward to the full scale video. It's just dissapointing when you wait for almost nothing - and that in low res.
Now i'm off to bed. Hope to see a turnaround when i wake up again.
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 11 minutes ago
Michael: It wasnt low res, but made that way by KS. You live and learn.
the tiles equate to 270 square inches, they can be put together in any way, but 4x4 foot would work
Mike Masser 11 minutes ago
@Prodos: A few questions
1) Are the tiles for the game final version or work in progress.
2) When will we see digital/model photos of the newer figures e.g. Warrior.
3) Will we see the sprues of the minis, digital or resin before the end of the KS.
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 9 minutes ago
The £185k has already been unlocked, the 190k is the crusher.
Mike 1Actual tiles will arrive with us this week
2 When they are approved
3. yes
Jesper Kjaergaard-Jensen 10 minutes ago
Prodos, what is the material of the figures? Is it just another name for resin?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 8 minutes ago
Jesper. No its a different m,aterial to GW?FW resin, but it is most similar to resin, but very flexible, less prone to bubbles and holds detail much better
Kieran McGrann 8 minutes ago
@ Prodos
For the boardgame, you mentioned it can be set up any way, as with the main game is ther a way to randomise the board through game rules?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 7 minutes ago
Kieran: Basic game follows a mission set. For the advanced it can be put together how people wish. We will also have a randomniser method
Philip Holgate 7 minutes ago
@Prodos oh.... So we already have the £185k goal sorted?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 7 minutes ago
Philip yes
Pvt Ricco "Frosty" Frost 2 minutes ago
was the video only 5mins long or have i missed something
Kieran McGrann 1 minute ago
@Prodos
That sounds good. As a life long space hulk fan this seems very good especially with the solo play.
How does the solo play work?
Jesper Kjaergaard-Jensen 1 minute ago
Prodos, what are the sizes of the resin terrain pieces? They look awesome, but not sure of the actual size of hallways etc. only the rooms have a size (6"x6")
Creator Prodos Games Ltd less than a minute ago
Ricco: yes
Keiran: Single player: You play Marines vs Aliens. You defend the post, last man standing etc. Aliens are controlled by dice and cards.
Jesper: Its stated on the main page (under the add on picture for it)
Creator Prodos Games Ltd 1 minute ago
Jesper the material accepts any acryllic paint AND doesnt need washing before hand.
Mike Masser 1 minute ago
@Prodos: Probably a dumb question, but can you tell us what exactly what needs to be approved for you to release models and game content?
Creator Prodos Games Ltd less than a minute ago
Mike every aspect!
As to my commitment to the KS, I'm staying in at 'Payback Time' and see how it all develops over the next 10 days
)
. And your points are totally valid Hellfury / Jake, hopefully the forthcoming update addresses some of them. But the humor is appreciated, too 
